Where is the evidence to support greater injury risk in big victories?
General question??
How many City players were injured vs Leeds? None
Were we hammering Everton when we sustained our two worst injuries last season?
No
If thats the only argument then it is sn extremely weak one.
Itās a long season and most sides who are competitive year on year are so because they take opportunities where they come up to take their foot off the gas after a game is already put to bed. Utd were masters at having won a game after 60 minutes and walking through the final 30 mins. For us the distinction in our approach is huge because of how high octane our primary approach is. For City, the way they shut down a game is not too dissimilar from the way they approach from the kick off, meaning they can ease off and still make chances more easily than we can. Itās that rather than bloodlust of not wanting to take their foot of the neck of a beaten opponent that sees them able to so often get their 4th, 5th and 6th goal.
Ultimately though, season after season, what dictates the title is not how often sides get that fifth goal, but how often sides are raring for it from the opening kick off. If you genuinely think that there is no reason to think that conserving energy in a long season in games that are already long won is the best preparation for being completely ready for the next game, then I dont think any argument that can put in front of you will sway you, but you would be in a very small minority of people with that perspective.
Weāre coming up towards the halfway point of the season, a game in hand on City but 4 points behind , level on games with Chelsea but ahead on points. In both cases we are also ahead on Goal difference.
Totally ignoring the conversation though.
Not in the slightest.
To answer the specific question, I donāt think there is any evidence to support greater injury risk in big victories. But related to that, there is lots of evidence to support greater injury risk with playing longer, at a higher intensity.
To liken the season to a marathon, as many do, you donāt start sprinting less than half way through. The amount of energy is finite. You have to keep something left in the tank. Itās a long race.
Personally scoring loads is great but at the end of the day itās that back line that wins you titles. Not conceding is equally as effective as scoring and makes winning games and getting 3 points easier.
What needs to be taken into account is that Cheaters have the squad to put out two teams of equal standing every weekā¦ We donāt
When Cheaters keep on turning the screw in a game like Leeds, it might be because they can make 6 or 7 changes for the next match without a drop in standardsā¦ we could possibly make 2-3ā¦!
If we have a constant attrition of our guys over 90minutes every game whether match has been won or not, it will certainly take its toll come towards the end of the seasonā¦ and as the CL final comes right at the end of the campaign, the last thing I want is to lose the final because we run out of steam half-way through the gameā¦
Keep our powder dry every chance we get I sayā¦ :0)
I donāt think this is really that much the case, is it? I think itās more that when weāve had injuries lately they seem to concentrate mainly within one or two positions, whereas City hasnāt faced an injury crisis the depth of what weāve hadā¦
Yes they have. They lost Laporte for half a season. Everyone knows thatās why we won the league in 19/20.
And including Community Shield and the dead rubber game against Leipzig, theyāve lost five more games than the mean and mighty reds.
There are some excellent rebuttals of why it was prudent to take the foot off the gas at 5 up against Ole.
In that game, the ref allowed a lot of challenges and incidences. Think of the petulance from Ronaldo. The challenge on Curtis from Penandes.
Instead of the ref speaking to slabhead to calm his team down, he allowed them to play that way resulting in the challenge on Keita.
The sending off was at 60min, and at 5 down and a man down, it was the right decision to ease off, as the ref was now taking pity and any 50-50 was going to the scumās favour. As I think I said in the match thread at that time, this was the signal for the team that they would not get reward for their hard effort, so better off just doing a training session.
The thing with West Ham, Brighton and Brentford was we tried and couldnt score goals.
Vs Utd, Everton etc we could have had six more.
And still assumptions re injuries etc when there is no evidence to support the contention.
But fuck it, I think we should have scored more others dont. Thats life.
The fact with the WHU, Brighton and Brentford games is we conceded 2-3 goals. The Brentford game was appalling defensively.
We shouldnāt need 4 goals to beat Brentford Iām sorry.
Just so itās clear, are you saying that playing for longer, at a higher intensity, does not increase the risk of injury?
@RedOverTheWater
Apologies and fucked up the quoteā¦
Are you saying that injury is a definite occurence in every match that professionals play? At high intensity?
Of course you are not.
Players are trained to compete for ninety minutes in every game. There is zero real evidence that playing at 60% capacity lessens risk of injury.
If Liverpool were 2 goals down with ten minutes left would you start thinking lets go easy lads, busy schedule ahead etc?
As I said before, in matches like Brentford etc we couldnt buy a winning goal, and dedended poorly.
Goal difference exists for a reason, it is a deciding factor in some instances. To feel sorry for any opponent is in my view less than satisfactory, if you take chances you score goals.
And to reiterate
West Ham, Brighton etc are big factors in our season, like Chelsea with Everton last night.
My original point which caused people to get wound up was that I would dread a scenario where City and Liverpool tie on say 90 points and City have a goal better goal difference.
Brighton was a game we tried to win for 90 minutes and were not able so its a moot pointā¦
Butā¦we could have another six goals at least if we went full throttle vs Utd, Arsenal, Everton and Southampton.
I am saying that playing longer, at a higher intensity, increases the risk of injury.
I would imagine there is a lot of evidence to support that basic contention, and I take it as a given. It is worth pointing out that Klopp and the sports science people at Liverpool seem to agree with this too, as they routinely manage the players with regard to how many minutes they play at a high level, how many games, how intense, how much rest, and so on and so forth. The basic point is pretty straightforward: playing longer, at a higher intensity, increases the risk of injury.
Iām not sure if your 2-0 down example is serious or not, but obviously if we were 2-0 down with 10 mins to go, I would not be in favor of taking it easy because the of the busy schedule ahead. Nobody would, because the the sporting objective is to win the game. And if you donāt win, the next objective is to try to get the draw. Even a single point earned from a draw would be much more valuable than 10+ goals scored when the going was good, which is why you keep fighting.
In the 5-0 Man Utd game the sporting objective was achieved. The points were in the bag, and a statement victory was secured. Klopp could have pumped them up from the sidelines, demanding that they keep pressing on for another goal or two, but crucially he did not. Why?
Because the job was done, and he was managing the resources of the team in order to maximize our prospects over a long season.
Anyway, at this point I think it has all been said.
If that is the premise of your position, then the premise is wrong. Unequivocally. Doesnt mean that its necessarily wrong to want to keep your foot on the gas right until the final whistle on every game that youāve already won, because there are a lot of opposing forces dictating the risk-benefit of that, but this premise is unquestionably incorrect.
See, your unequivocally wrong comment is in itself wrong.
You are talking definites that simply dont exist.
If Liverpool had scored two more goals vs United the belief held commonly is that players were in danger of being injured.
There is no way of knowing.
Easing up is definitely a type of game management but to me adding on goals should be done when possible.
Anyway, its amazing how a comment becomes a discussion point, and how things like goal difference or replacing Mo Salah gets people thinking and arguing.
Pep has recorded an āinconclusiveā Covid test.
His test for Cokevid was positive of course.