UK Politics Thread (Part 4)

When? When was this follow-up additional vote? I must have missed that.

If you’re referring to the 2019 elections, you would know very well it had nothing to do with a second referendum or not. You can’t even get the facts right.

Accept what? That the referendum was a shitshow filled with electoral manipulation?

And yes, many, not all, of the people who voted leave in 2016 were still as dumb in 2019, and are still as dumb in 2024. Welcome to humanity in the 21st century, where ignorance is actively celebrated.

You seem to have a chip on your shoulder about “remainers”. You won, get over it. Except you won… Nothing. Nothing but a shit future for most people in the country.

Yes, and? I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make here, because your link explicitly supports what I said:

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And yet…

  • Jeremy Corbyn voted for Britain to leave the European Economic Community (EEC) in the 1975 European referendum.
  • Jeremy Corbyn opposed the creation of the European Union (EU) under the Maastricht Treaty – speaking and voting against it in Parliament in 1993. During the 2016 referendum campaign, Left Leave highlighted repeated speeches he made in Parliament opposing Europe during 1993.
  • Jeremy Corbyn voted against the Lisbon Treaty on more than one occasion in Parliament in 2008.
  • In 2010, Jeremy Corbyn voted against the creation of the European Union’s diplomatic service.
  • Jeremy Corbyn voted for a referendum on Britain’s membership of the EU in 2011 (breaking the Labour whip to do so).
  • In 2011 Jeremy Corbyn also opposed the creation of the EU’s European Stability Mechanism, which helps members of the Euro in financial difficulties. (This vote is a good example of how Corbyn votes with hardcore Euro-sceptics. Only 26 other MPs joined him in voting against, and in their number are the likes of right-wing Euro-sceptics such as Peter Bone, Douglas Carswell, Bill Cash, Ian Paisley Junior and John Redwood.)
  • Jeremy Corbyn opposed Britain’s participation in the EU’s Banking Authority in 2012.
  • In 2016 his long-time left-wing ally Tariq Ali said that he was sure that if Corbyn was not Labour leader he would be campaigning for Britain to leave the EU, whilst his brother Piers Corbyn also said that Jeremy Corbyn was privately opposed to Britain’s membership of the European Union.
  • Jeremy Corbyn went on holiday during the 2016 referendum campaign and his office staff consistently undermined the Remain campaign. He refused to attend a key Remain campaign launch and also attacked government ministers for publicising the Remain case, saying they should also have promoted arguments in favour of Leave vote. The Director of the Remain campaign, himself a Labour member and candidate, said, “Rather than making a clear and passionate Labour case for EU membership, Corbyn took a week’s holiday in the middle of the campaign and removed pro-EU lines from his speeches”. During the referendum campaign, Leave.EU highlighted Corbyn’s attacks on Europe made in 1996.
  • The day after the European referendum in 2016, Jeremy Corbyn called for the immediate invocation of Article 50 – the two-year notice to leave the EU – much quicker than even Theresa May wanted.
  • In December 2016, Jeremy Corbyn voted in Parliament in favour of the UK leaving the EU and for the process to start no later than 31 March 2017.
  • Jeremy Corbyn three times voted in February 2017 in favour of the Prime Minister starting the process of leaving the European Union.
  • During the 2017 general election, the independent Channel 4 Factcheck service found very little difference between Jeremy Corbyn and Theresa May over Europe.
  • In the summer of 2017, Jeremy Corbyn opposed Britain remaining in the Single Market. He even sacked from his team Labour MPs who voted in favour of membership of the Single Market.
  • In 2018, Jeremy Corbyn said he would try to make Brexit go ahead even if Labour won a general election before it happened.
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Yes, and? I never said he was an ardent Remain supporter. I never said he campaigned on the issue as much as he campaigned against the EU over the years.

I merely pointed out that when he did campaign during the run-up to the referendum, he campaigned on that specific platform, which I highlighted in the post you quoted.

And regardless, the original point was what did Labour offer to voters. I explained why they might have chosen the party in 2017 and 2019. I cannot offer any comment on the leadership election of 2015, because I wasn’t paying attention to that at the time.

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With regards unemployment, I see where you are and agree the overall unemployment figure hasn’t changed significantly since leaving. However, it doesn’t capture that people found other work.

Regarding being poorer its isnt probably, maybe or possibly. We are.

These pictures probably show the reality. We are not where we were predicted to be if we didnt leave.


Scare tactics. It actually happened though. Call it what you want, it was in reality a prediction that actually played out.

Nine water companies, including stricken Thames Water, have been prevented from using customer money to fund “undeserved” bonuses for top bosses worth £6.8 million under new powers, the regulator has announced.

Ofwat said it had stepped in to halt water companies that cannot show that bonuses are sufficiently linked to performance from using customer money to fund the payouts, amounting to 73% of the total executive awards proposed across the industry.

Debt-laden Thames Water is among three firms – also including Yorkshire Water, and Dwr Cymru Welsh Water – which were directly blocked from allowing customers to pay £1.55 million of bonuses.

Ofwat said a further six companies had voluntarily decided not to push the cost of executive bonuses worth a combined £5.2 million onto customers, with shareholders instead paying.

It added it would otherwise have moved to block the payouts.

David Black, chief executive of Ofwat, said: “In stopping customers from paying for undeserved bonuses that do not properly reflect performance, we are looking to sharpen executive mindsets and push companies to improve their performance and culture of accountability.

“While we are starting to see companies take some positive steps, they need to do more to rebuild public trust.”

Ofwat said new rules on water company bonuses and dividend payouts to shareholders were “beginning to bite” in their first full year since being introduced.

In blocking the awards, Ofwat will instead adjust costs for the companies so that they cannot recover it from customers.

It revealed that Thames Water – more than £16 billion in debt and at the centre of growing public outrage over pollution and rising bills – was planning to use customer cash to pay £770,000 in bonuses for its chief executive Chris Weston and chief financial officer Alastair Cochran.

Action was also taken against £616,000 worth of payouts for top bosses at Yorkshire Water and £163,000 of bonuses at Dwr Cymru Welsh Water.

Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Steve Reed said: “It is disgraceful that half of water companies have given out unjustifiable and unmerited bonuses.

“That is why this Government is introducing urgent legislation to ban the payment of unfair bonuses to polluting water bosses so payouts of this kind can never happen again.

“But there are deeper issues that need long-term solutions, which is why we have launched the largest review of the sector since privatisation.”

Water firms paid out a total of £9.3 million in executive bonuses over the last financial year, Ofwat revealed.

It comes at a time of growing public and political pressure on the sector to address a dire recent performance on sewage pollution and leaks while customer bills are soaring.

Ofwat said it would be able to block bonus payouts entirely under the new water Bill being brought by the Government.

The regulator also published its latest report on water firm resilience showing that £1 billion was paid out in shareholder dividends in 2023-24, though this was £400 million less than the previous year thanks to a “clearer link” to performance.

In the report, it named Thames Water, South East Water and Southern Water as being in need of action to address big holes in their finances.

This means that the three firms are subject to high priority monitoring and cash lock-up measures, which prevents them from paying dividends without approval from the regulator.

A further seven companies have been declared as having an “elevated concern” over their financial resilience, while six firms are deemed to be “standard”, with no specific concerns over their financial health.

Mr Black said: “Our new rules on exec pay and dividends link both to company performance

“Through these new rules, our enforcement action and our incentive regime, which has imposed £430 million in performance penalties since 2020, we are challenging companies to deliver improvements for both customers and the environment.”

Water watchdog Ofwat is expected to confirm in December how much it will allow water companies to increase their bills by over the next five years.

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Serious question is what are bonuses in this industry based on. Performance targets is a usual metric which makes me question what those targets actually were.

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When did they bring this in??

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Are you new? It’s been around for a long time!

You can’t say anything these days…

Obligatory @Mascot tag.

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Ratko Mladić has let himself go.

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What? You get thrown in jail, these days, just for saying you’re Morrissey?

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Seriously, where to fucking start with Morrissey? What an absolutely, colossal knobrash of a man.

I’m not even on about his nasty opinions, which of course are deplorable. Or his inability to distinguish between having an opinion and spreading racially motivated misinformation that leads to criminal damage.

For me, the thing that catapults this cockwomble into the stratosphere of grade A pricks is the sheer fucking arrogant entitlement of him. The lack of any self-awareness to understand the real reasons why he struggles to get his music released. Which are that he hasn’t produced anything of any worth for over twenty years, and having spent a similar timescale alienating most of his fanbase, he is now in the position where any record company with a grain of sense isn’t going to touch him with a bargepole. As with all these stories of cancellation, it isn’t a political decision. It’s a commercial one.

If Morrissey really wanted to release his music he could very easily finance it himself and release it independently. That is well within his means. But he would much prefer someone else front up the cash to fund him wringing the creative dregs of the talent he once had and pay to market it to a public who only really seem to recognise him now as ‘that bellend’.

And I say that as someone who absolutely loved The Smiths.

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tbf World Peace Is None of Your Business (2014) was decent. It was after that he lost the plot. His Israel track on the next album was the final straw for me.

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For me it perfectly illustrates why I am glad he isn’t. He has honourable ideals however that conflicts with reality. It assumes motives are based upon genuine concerns, beliefs or ideals. Things that can be negotiated. Some sort of morals that align with international thinking.

Putin has little empathy for human life, believes he can reshape world order through power and wants a legacy. His motives are far more based on greed, power and intimidation.

As John McCain once said about Russia “A Gas Station Run by a Mafia That Is Masquerading as a Country”

It’s akin trying to negotiate with a criminal wanting protection money.

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Rumours on Bluesky that Reeves resignation is imminent

Could be based upon a percentage figure of what he saves the company/shareholders… by dumping waste water in the rivers, instead of the costly exercise of filtering and disposing of it responsibly…!

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I thought The Smiths would have been great as an instrumental group. I always thought Morrisey was a bellend. It felt like he was taking the piss out of his bandmates.

Seems like he was taking the piss out of his fans as well.

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