I think this is a really good summary. I’d add that a further complication is that some of the players, especially some of the newer ones, aren’t really right for those tactics anymore too.
It’s the one I think is the biggest issue. We are LFC there are clubs that want all of our players if they can afford them. The players would be willing to go to at least some of those clubs. Put it this way, if we paid off these players contracts and made them all free agents do you think they’d be snapped up by clubs they think are decent? Indeed they’d probably end up on better wages than they’d need to be offered to take the moves under normal transfer situations.
I disagree with your suggestion that their ageing is detrimental to us at this time.
But it will do? Hence a reasonable discussion in a thread about what future business we should look to do? Maybe somewhere such as a what players we’d buy thread maybe? Just fed up on all the contempt and shit slinging that goes on in here.
We started to struggle in January leading up to the winter break and continued to do so afterwards
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What’s wrong with it is you’re suggesting that the squad was losing drive and energy during a league campaign in which (up to the lockdown) we barely dropped a point.
What definition of ‘drive’ are you using here? Because in my mind a squad of players amassing wins and points at the rate we did between August 2019 and April 2020 is certainly not lacking ‘drive’ and it’s frankly insulting to the players who put that phenomenal run together to suggest so.
We can have a good discussion about the reasons for the drop off this year, although I suspect we’ll disagree. I think there are multiple factors - the injuries, the lack of fans, the metaphorical exhalation of breath from finally winning that title, the effect of going at unbelievable levels for three years prior, and the squad getting older (although there is plenty of life in these players yet)
But please don’t suggest that the drop off was starting to happen before the COVID break. That’s just absolute nonsense.
I don’t disagree with the point about size and physicality, and I’m not in complete disagreement on age. Which is why I haven’t mentioned them.
I’m just a bit perplexed that anyone could suggest the teams drive was starting to wane between August 19 and April 20. Drive and Energy was what those runs were built on.
I’m a bit fed up with poster making shit up to reinforce their points, but I suppose we all have our crosses to bear
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Thank you I’m glad someone else remembers it.
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You were implying it was already detrimental to the team’s performances. Now you are saying its about future impact. Perhaps some consistency in your argument may help things be more constructive.
Did I? What I said was it was starting to happen. There were some extremely tired displays between the winter and covid break. That doesn’t mean it was a problem yet but something starting to happen which will therefore need taking into account when we next do recruitment.
I don’t buy the “our squad is ageing” being the reason for the fall in performances. Too many variables to pin it on one thing.
Yes, as players age, they lose a yard of pace, but they adapt and continue. Real Madrid’s squad is older than ours, and they beat us comfortably, Barca still have the same players in their spine. The key is to bring in younger players to take over as time passes. Not to start binning off the spine and replacing them one in one out.
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That’s exactly what I suggested doing…
I’ll be brutally honest with you ArD, I used to like your posting on TiA, but since the move to TAN you have become so so hard to engage with, to the point I added you to ignore because there is no engagement anymore.
You appear to take a stance and then defend it to hard it just becomes this embittered and entrenched dialogue which is exhausting. A perfect example is the Finances of the club, you literally stated in your first post about that topic you weren’t an export, then maybe a month later you are telling some of our best posters with regards to Finance knowledge they are wrong and posting pages of missinformation about things like amortization.
Hopefully you take this post with the constructive criticism intended, as I say I agree with you on a lot, I still do, but your style of posting has got very very entrenched on any topic.
p.s. I’m sure there is a long long list of how my posting could be better 
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I didn’t say you didnt say that…
Sorry getting a lot of backlash over it. Making me snappy I guess.
I’ve just probably forgotten because of all the football matches we were winning at the time.
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Whatever happens, I really don’t think that this side should rely on pressing for creativity in the future. If that means releasing Wijnaldum, selling Keita and AOC, benching/selling Firmino (not all at once, of course), I’ll accept that, as long as the right players are brought in. I have to bring up Man City once more as their transfers reinforced not just their side but also underlined Guardiola’s desire to play a more patient game, make his side less vulnerable to counter-attacks and set-pieces, all while making them more ruthless in front of goal (even if that means they’re not blowing teams out of the water anymore). Klopp’s side needs a bit of that, albeit at reduced prices.
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Of course, a group that achieves what these lads have brings that strength and unity. Just as a season like this one can errode some of that, or players getting older and thinking about new challenges can affect their performances.
The point was more one to highlight that whilst we’ve done some business over the past few windows, we’ve only really got two who would be in our best 11. Thiago in time might make that but right now I wouldn’t say he’s in our best 11. Jota probably should but that’s based on Mane and Firmino’s form rather than him having proved to be an undeniable improvement on either and Klopp still seems to prefer his tried and tested players.
As the growth has stopped, we can’t magically hope it returns. As much as I hate Ferguson he proved time and time again he could rebuild sides and when they had a down season he was quick to address that with new players or new coaches. The players weren’t allowed to go stale. The style evolved even if the general approach that underpinned things remained. And new voices had new ideas and ways of communicating so the message to the players wasn’t the same year after year.
So no, new players aren’t an automatic solution and certainly aren’t guaranteed but adding a couple of squad players and trying again with the same core, voices and approach seems like a bad idea to me.
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The parallels between City and us are really interesting, and I think Guardiola has actually taken his cue from our performance last year. They are certainly a much more controlling team than they have been in the past, and that something we developed last season. There was a maturity to us last year, which was in stark contrast to the heavy metal football of the previous campaigns.
I personally think we need to find a bit of a cutting edge to our play. We’re still, even now, perfectly capable of controlling a game of football, but we’re struggling to get the goal that this platform should provide.
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Jan last year: we drew with Shrewsbury Town in FA cup, that’s the only game in Jan we didn’t win. That’s 6 wins, one draw (by a youth team)
Feb: 4 wins, 1 loss away at Atletico, and 1 loss to Watford.
March: loss to chelsea away, win against Bournmouth, loss to Atleti.
I’ll take ‘struggling’ all day any day. Did we go from winning every game to losing occasionally? Yes. Is this struggling? No. Overall record from Jan to break: 11 wins, 4 loses, one draw. League form: 10 wins, 2 loses.
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