Nobody’s perfect.
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It could be argued that the concept of Jesus has had a greater impact on human kind than the existence of any other person. You note my use of the word impact.
I’ve been thinking of another thread for a few weeks on a similar line. Will put it together.
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I think he’s entitled to his opinion and his belief, as is everyone. It doesn’t mean that because he’s Jurgen Klopp, The manager of Liverpool anyone who supports Liverpool and doesn’t share that belief now suddenly needs to rethink their life choices, now does it. So with that in mind, what’s your point? Besides trying to score a cheap one, that is.
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It seems to help him to be the decent man he is. Good for him and good for us, no problems at all with that.
Same could be said of Mo and others. If their religion helps them to become better human beings, then who is to argue against it?
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It’s up to him what he believes.
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Swabian protestantism, you can blame it on that if we don’t spend big again in the next transfer window
( 
)
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I reject the unfair accusation of trying to score a cheap point. That sort of intolerance stymies discussion. Also, you are setting up a straw man, as it doesn’t follow that the Liverpool manager being a sincere Christian believer means that fans need to reevaluate their own belief.
What I posted is relevant.
The thread is about religion. The thing that we all have in common on this forum is that we are Liverpool fans. We have numerous players who are religious, and our manager is too. So I asked what people thought about that, with particular reference to the manager.
If the response is that everyone is entitled to their opinion and belief, then fine. That’s very magnanimous of you.
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I think we’d all agree that anybody can believe whatever they want in the privacy of their own head. It’s only a problem when the belief is immoral AND they act upon it. Doesn’t matter if they’re Liverpool manager or a teacher. I wouldn’t mind if he were an Everton fan as long as he was always utterly professional as our manager. I love Henderson and he’s an ardent Sunderland fan.
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We all know Jurgen is Christian. I’m also a bit confused what you hoped to gain from raising it.
If Jurgen was atheist, would that be something you should consider? Or does it not in fact matter?
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Yes, the Liverpool manager is a Christian. I’m not sure that has been discussed in the thread. If it has, I missed it. I definitely didn’t see anything like the quotes I posted in the article above, which were pretty unequivocal. Jurgen Klopp is not a cultural Christian, but definitely seems to be a sincere believer, and in particular, a follower of Jesus.
It’s pertinent to the thread, since it is about religion.
The obvious added point of interest is that this is a Liverpool FC forum and the person I am talking about is our manager. If I was talking about the manager of the local ASDA, much as her faith might be dear to her, it might carry less interest among the Liverpool fan base.
I have been active in the thread and the general viewpoint, from many on here, has been to cast aspersions at people of faith. This has come in many guises, both explicit and implicit. So, in light of that sort of undercurrent, here is Jurgen Klopp.
Any assessment of the man would include the following words: Humble. Leader. Caring. Educated. Generous. Passionate. Obviously world class in his field. I could go on and on about his plus points. We all could. I’m sure everyone in here loves the man, both who he is, and what he has done for us.
I thought it apposite to point out that yes, our manager is a sincere believer, a person of genuine faith, in his case a follower of Jesus, and not afraid to speak about it.
On a personal note I do take some comfort in having that in common with him, especially when holding religious belief increasingly feels like you are swimming against the tide, as this thread amply demonstrates.
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Possibly the same as when you’ve posted his thoughts on Brexit in the past?
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Not so. Most of the people not so fond of religion generally are, nonetheless, tolerant of others right to believe what they wish. The people of faith generally choose to portray non believers as sinners etc as well as use spurious evidence at best to give an actual historical grounding for the faith, in this instance Christianity. Fair enough, there is no debate without disagreement and I can absolutely live with someone making an argument for a religion even if I won’t myself think they are right. It does tend to devolve when facts get blurred and/or when one uses an argument that is bound to get another’s back up. Like the sinner argument that @Klopptimist takes umbrage with.
Religion is not inclusive as much as it sometimes wishes to portray itself as being so and has generally had a convert or enslave/destroy policy over the millenia and up til today. People now are much more able to push back and say the proverbial screw you. Don’t take it personally, religion has forced itself upon the world’s populations by any means necessary so you can expect some push back now without feeling a bit dismayed but at the same time superior about it.
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But Mo’s a Muslim and he’s a great guy too. What should we do?
Brian Cox is an Atheist and he’s sound. I don’t know what to do.
Yes, Mo seems like an ace fella, no arguments whatsoever there. I referenced our Christian and Muslim players when I posted about Klopp, above.
I haven’t seen any quotes from Mo where he talks about his faith, but if you have any, I’d be interested to read about that. That’s what was so interesting to me about Jurgen. His quotes were so unequivocal, and you rarely hear a public figure talk in that way about their faith.
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Oh dear. It’s as if talking is the only form of communication of one’s faith. The whole world knows unequivocally that Mo is a devout Muslim (you’ve probably missed all of his sujud goal celebrations), his public image has been credited to a demonstrable decrease in anti-Islam sentiment in Merseyside (I read that awhile back, I am sure I can find the reference again if you wish) and his image as a devout and practicing Muslim has also been responsible for conversion to Islam (silly imho but there you go 
). He’s also literally named his daughter after the most holy place in his religion.
My point in bringing this up isn’t religion itself but your arguments where you have the tendency to ignore the point of the reply to you and double down on what you said earlier, in this case Jurgen being a Christian. Mo was referenced and your default was to try and assault that position, gently and subtly it must be said, by basically going ‘great, what did Mo say because I haven’t heard him say squat about his faith but Jurgen, oh boy!’, which goes back to your initial comment about what we think about Jurgen being a devout Christian.
I definitely stand by my opinion that you tried to score a cheap point by starting this line of posting.
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its all good guys, being a catholic i’ll make sure to put a good word in for all you other lot, i mean its not your fault after all, is it?
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believing in a religion doesn’t make bad people.
That’s their choice.
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I think that hes humble, caring, principled because he used to wear glasses. Just like me. Now that he doesnt wear glasses I expect he’ll go to bare-eyed hell.
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Oh dear to you. You might be confused. Of course I know Mo is a devout Muslim. I mentioned our Christian and Muslim players in the first post I did above, when I shared the article on Klopp’s faith.
Not really sure where you are coming from here? It would be good if you read what I’m saying and stopped arguing against stuff I’m not saying.
To reiterate. Jurgen talked about his faith, hence I posted what he said, in a thread on a Liverpool forum that is about religion in all its forms. In the first post I did mentioning Klopp’s faith I mentioned Liverpool players with faith, though I didn’t name them, as I was posting an article about Klopp.
You seem to want me to talk about the faith of others at Liverpool? Is that what you want me to do? If so I believe Allison is a devout Christian, Bobby was baptized by Allison not so long ago, and there may be one or two other Christians, but they come to mind first. Then Mo is a devout Muslim, as is Sadio, Keita, Konate too I think. We have about half the team who are either Christian or Muslim, it seems.
The scope of my post was to talk about Jurgen’s faith, and I put up an article with some powerful quotes from the man,
Someone else brought Mo up (Craig Johnston, I think). Since he raised Mo I asked if he had any information where the player talked about his faith, similar to the article I put up where Jurgen talked about his faith, as that would have been inter3sting to read.
It is a given that Mo is a Muslim. Oh dear indeed if you feel the need to argue that point with me, as though I don’t know it.
The scope of my post was about the managers faith.
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