The problem is that the current growth in far right politics isn’t confined to callow youth on the internet. The biggest purveyors of far right ideals in Ireland are mature people who have a problem with everything, from gender identity to vaccinations to the use of plastic to purchase.
They are not from a generation that “has nothing”…most of them benefit from the system they puport to despise.
I think that small group have the capacity to influence those who are untouched by WW2 attrocity though. And the internet is the best vehicle to do so.
Your thesis has merit, in the dissemination of their bile. But the source is the place where we need examination.
2 Likes
There are always going to be individuals who grow up with nothing,but as a whole it’s a long time since this country has been that way.If you grew up from the 90’s onwards the chances are if you put youself out there to create a good life for your and yours then that goal could be achieved.
1 Like
Question.
Why is right sided propaganda, messaging and the like more successful at influencing people?
From a UK perspective we seem to have been drifting to the right for some time and we’ve ended up being quite a way down that line. It also appears we’ll get a bit of a reset in the coming months but there’s no way we’ll be lurching way into the left side of the political spectrum.
It would not surprise me one bit if we then drift further to the right again over the next decade, unless something significant happens that really makes people rethink things.
1 Like
As for Germany, the over 70s group had the weakest AfD support of all age groups. Just saying. Might be a number of reasons for that, e.g. that older people are more set in their ways and which political parties they vote for. Or a better grasp of not so long ago history. Or less social media bullshit.
4 Likes
Because it’s binary and stupid and people are fuckwits. Good bad, beautiful ugly, right wrong black white…
Austerity was sold as good house keeping, To counter that you need to explain that there’s no point keeping the house if the the house itself is falling down (and needs investment) the counter arguement has too many words and isn’t punchy enough.
The center and left tend to be ‘pseudo’ intellectuals who wish to educate people haven’t the time nor the intelligence for this. This is why the tabloids had such an influence and the Torygraph just said the same thing just reapeating it 5 more times to make a longer ‘article’.
Btw the target groups are different, ‘Lock him up’ wouldn’t work for the democrats however for Trump ‘Lock her up’ was extremely effective. So let’s face it it’s about education.
3 Likes
France is interesting. A definite sanction vote for Macron in there.
We have got to the stage where people want their dignity back.
Essentially many felt they had no choice other than the Rassemblement Nationale.
It might have been missed by many that the Parti Socialiste is back in the room. This will play massively for the legislatives imo. Many who didn’t see that happening could well go back there.
What’s funny is Macron’s government was made up of soft idiots from the left who couldn’t stand up on a flat surface and nasty self centered right wingers (it just couldn’t last) and a president lost in some sort of colonial capitalist wilderness. Passing what noone wanted by force and not understanding why people didn’t like that.
Something had to give it just took more time than with Hollande.
What is worrying is how the west of France has fallen to the Rassemblement Nationale. This is worrying as it was ‘the’ bastion preventing Le Pen (still the major towns held out).
So Macron is looking at cohabitation, we haven’t seen that in a long time. Traditionally the president keeps ‘control’ of foriegn policy and the government runs the country. I can not see Le Pen adherring to that.
It’s a big gamble by Macron imo, does he think giving Le Pen 3 years will be enough for people to realise that France for the French doesn’t work either?
5 Likes
A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes.
2 Likes
It’s a really complex issue that thousands of academics at top institutions all over the world are trying to understand, but I’ll have a go anyway.
My theory is that since the eighties, and the rise of neoliberalism, there has been a swing away from the collective and towards much more individualistic attitudes. People are much more concerned about themselves and less about their community; “No such thing as society” etc. added to this there has been a reduction in spending on social services, housing and health which has left many disenchanted with current governments. The constant blaming of the weakest in society for the problems caused by the most powerful, the division sown by unscrupulous politicians and media and the amplification of the shrillest and most hateful messages by social media have all come together to create a perfect breeding ground for the politics of division and mistrust.
4 Likes
Because it’s someone elses fault and your paying the price???
2 Likes
Because they have the biggest megaphone and they shout the loudest.
2 Likes
Empty vessels make the most noise.
2 Likes
Thanks all. Interesting responses
While I agree I also think its more subtle than just that. I think @Bekloppt response is a fascinating one on how we’ve basically become increasingly selfish and how that is being driven by the erosion of public services among other things. Society is certainly more angry nowadays and the right side is more able to tap into that it seems.
2 Likes
The Republicans 
are seeking an electoral alliance with Le Pen. 
2 Likes
Les Republicans were demolished in the European elections. The leader is Eric Ciotti is a complete idiot, it’s a party that has drifted further to the right however there’s still a lot who believe in republican values. This could destroy them completely.
In any case Le Pen will not accept she has to see where this leads 1st.
The Reconquete party lead by Eric Zemmour (a really perverted psudeo intellectual) with Le Pens niece, Marion Maréchal, are more likely to form a voting platform however it wouldn’t be coherent. The jostling for position could be fun.
I’m not sure where all this is going or will lead. Zemmour is worst than Le Pen imo as he’s completly detached from the ‘people’ (just full of nonsense hanging on to colonialism).
One thing is clear imo if the socalistes can not pull this back traditional french politics is dead. Republican values could be chucked out the window leaving a directionless horde of nincompoops.
2 Likes
Another element to that: when people are afraid, they tend to vote conservative and far right (the parties generally promising increased ‘security’, whatever that means).
Anger and fear are a bad mixture.
2 Likes
Alternatively, there is now a fairly good amount of scientific support for the idea that a tendency towards fearful and angry reactions to things is a predisposing trait to being right wing. It produces a politics geared towards trying to assuage those feelings and so puts a focus on pursuing security and order (for them, at least)
2 Likes
It’s the logical consequence of the neoliberal dumbing down agenda; everything has to be emotive (look at how every news story nowadays is given a personal example) and logic (and the bigger picture) is therefore bypassed.
Nar. That might make you feel superior, that you are smart and educated enough to be driven by logic and knowledge, but it doesn’t work like that. You might not be driven by THESE specific emotions, but it doesn’t mean there arent other ones that underlie a lot of you ideas
2 Likes
No; he would’ve said “Fear and anger a bad mixture are.”
1 Like
