The Middle East Thread

Away End - General Chat
6394

Its worse than that. Israeli media and journalists reports that they are actively cooperating also with a band of around 300 people ideologically alligned with The Islamic state. I can find sources later, but I am traveling now.
Important to note that this tiny group cannot compete with larger factions, but its part of the Israeli fragmentation policy.

1 Like
6395

Journalists detained and menaced before being reluctantly released.

And:

By all means, let’s detain a seventy-years old lady who has devoted more than twenty years of her life in order to better Palestinian lives, legally and unviolently.

2 Likes
6396

Just read this somewhere…

I am Israel. I never miss a chance to claim victimhood while inflicting violence.

In 1947, the United Nations handed me more than half of someone else’s land. A gift I didn’t earn, from colonial powers who didn’t own it. I accepted. My neighbors objected. I called it war—and in the chaos, I began my cleansing. Over 700,000 Palestinians were driven from their homes—some fled, yes—but many were forced out at gunpoint, their villages razed, their names erased.

Then I planted pine trees over the ruins—to hide the memory. Forests where homes once stood. Parks over cemeteries. I made it green so the world wouldn’t see the black underneath. I called it “reforestation.” They called it erasure.

I am Israel. I have never chosen peace—only dominance.

In 1967, I launched a pre-emptive war and seized Gaza, the West Bank, East Jerusalem, the Golan Heights, and Sinai. I claimed it was for security. I held onto it for power. I built settlements, one by one, choking Palestinian towns. International law said it was illegal. I ignored it. My map grew. Their freedom shrank.

I am Israel. I could have ended the occupation. Many times. But I always said no.

In 2000, at Camp David, I offered a patchwork of disconnected enclaves surrounded by walls, checkpoints, and soldiers. I called it peace. Palestinians walked away. I called them extremists. Then I built a wall, not on my border—but deep in theirs. I called it security. They called it theft.

I am Israel. I glorify militarism. I raise children to believe they are chosen.

My textbooks erase Palestine. My soldiers patrol streets with rifles pointed at teenagers. My media justifies bombings. My politicians joke about flattening Gaza. I send airstrikes to refugee camps, schools, and hospitals. Then I say they were human shields.

I am Israel. I elected Netanyahu. Again and again.

Not once, by mistake. But knowingly. I voted for leaders who vowed to crush the Palestinians, to expand settlements, to never allow a Palestinian state. My ministers speak of “the Arabs” as a demographic threat. My settlers burn olive trees. My mobs chant “Death to Arabs.” I call it patriotism.

I am Israel. I speak of democracy—but deny it to millions under my control.

I rule over millions who cannot vote in the country that controls their lives. I build roads they cannot drive on. I issue permits for them to breathe, to move, to live. I bomb Gaza, then seal it off and say it’s their fault. I say I left Gaza—but I control its air, sea, and borders. I say they are free—then I starve them.

I am Israel. I demand recognition—but give none in return.

I demand that Palestinians accept me as a Jewish state—while refusing to even say the word “Nakba.” I ignore the homes, lands, and history of those I displaced. I hold their keys in museums, not their hands. I deny the refugees their right to return. I make laws that call them “absentees,” even when they’re just over the hill.

I am Israel. I cry antisemitism—when what I fear is accountability.

I call any critic a hater. I blur the line between Judaism and Zionism, using one to shield the crimes of the other. I weaponize history to excuse apartheid. I manipulate trauma to justify conquest. I say “Never again”—but let it happen to others, by my own hand.

I am Israel. I will never be secure.

2 Likes
6397

The text above is an accurate description of the history of this state, but only from one perspective.

It ignores ie. the numerous Israelis and Palestinians having tried in the past and still trying today to make piece, by inventing a life together. It ignores all the people currently trying to stand up to Netanyahou’s increasingly authoritarian regime.

Finally, it ignores the trauma of October 7th. It may have been largely self-inflicted, but it still needed an army of Palestinian fanatics to go into peaceful villages, and destroy the lives of entire families who, ironically enough, were on the side of peace, part of the people trying to stand up against hate and fear.

The problem with texts like the one you posted is that it doesn’t offer any solution going forward. Jews and Palestinians are now on this land in numbers , and both groups won’t go away. The only perspective is to find a way to live together, in mutual respect.

As long as that mutual respect and acceptance doesn’t exist, war will go on I’m afraid, and only become more and more sinister and violent.

The simple truth is: peace is the only possible way for both parts. Indulging in massacres will never resolve anything and only prolong the suffering on both sides.

4 Likes
6398

Many Israelis are against the genocide, and the continued occupation of Palestine. But the political mainstream is still ignoring this. Even Benny Gantz or Yair Lapid haven’t taken a definitive stance for ceasefire although Gantz resigned from the War Cabinet a year ago. While those campaigning for peace- Hadas, Labor, Yair Golan, are on political fringes.

6399

Yeah I know, a majority still isn’t ready for peace. But war will hurt their lives more and more. At some point, when everybody will have had enough, a majority on both sides will want peace.

2 Likes
6400

I disagree. I think most would accept a sustainable peace. But the people who want that and the politicians who represent them are two different people.

1 Like
6401

I don’t think what Israelis define peace as would be acceptable to Palestinians.

1 Like
6402
1 Like
6403
6404

Not really ready I’m afraid. Netanyahou was still voted in last term, and he retains a sizeable support in Israel, despite of the criticism. And on the other side, the old mummy Abbas on one hand, and Hamas on the other, retain their power.

To be really ready for peace is for a large majority of people on both sides to throw away the weapons, and to say ‘Stop this freaking shitshow, we aren’t doing this anymore’, and to start building bridges.

2 Likes
6405

Hamas will be considerably weakened if Abbas is removed and credible interim administration is put in place followed by a credible election. Abbas/PA/Fatah didn’t made a hero out of Hamas by colluding with Israel, and not to mention their insatiable corruption, they tried to exterminate progressive Palestinian groups like PFLP, DFLP, Third Way (Hanan Ashrawi), PNI (Mustafa Barghuti), etc.

1 Like
6406

Again. Nope.

The current Hamas leaders might face the blowback in the short term but you don’t kill the idealogy fully. And Hamas’s idealogy is self defeating

Any interim administration’s authority is rendered moot once they’ve got to rely on Warlords like Abbas or terrorists like Hamas in order to function.

It can even be a UN appointed interim administration with peacekeepers , but they’ll still fail if Warlords or terrorists are enabled.

6407

huh ?

Abbas is more of a quisling than he is a warlord.

1 Like
6408

In his domain , he’s a warlord. Even if he’s a quisling otherwise.

6409

(…)

One witness told BBC Arabic’s Middle East daily programme that he saw a group of young men dressed in civilian clothes and with their faces completely covered when he arrived in the area to get a box of food aid from the GHF site.

“At first, we thought they might be Palestinian youths helping with the process, but suddenly, they began shooting at us,” Hisham Saeed Salem said.

“Even those who managed to get a box of aid were targeted and shot. We still don’t know who these attackers are. They took everything from us - some even stole from us during the chaos,” he added.

Another man, Mohammed Sakout, said: “Several young men were shot and killed right behind me. I narrowly escaped death - some bullets passed just inches from my head.”

“At first, it was the Israeli army that was shooting at civilians. But today, we were shocked to discover the presence of gangs and militias,” he added.

At Nasser hospital in the nearby city of Khan Younis, a seriously injured man being treated for a gunshot wound to his neck, Mohammed Kabaga, told the Associated Press: “A group of masked armed men who were organising us starting firing towards us directly.”

“We went to get aid. They said to stand in line. We stood in line and suddenly they started shooting at us. While I was standing, I was surprised when a bullet hit me, I got dizzy and fell down,” he said.

(…)

1 Like
6410

Ah, the Israeli collaborators ‘fighting Hamas’. Does anyone remember the South Lebanese Army (SLA) or that scumbag Mohammed Dahlan from Gaza???

6411

Bit more information, and it’s not good

1 Like
6412

Israel has attacked 'nuclear ’ facilities in Iran :iran:.

Waiting for @Magnus to share some details on the ground.

2 Likes
6413

I’d just caught this on the news. I’d expected this thread to have gone bonkers by now.

Reports are that Iran has launched 100 drones in response.Israeli military strikes Iran nuclear targets; IDF says Iran has launched 100 drones towards Israel – live | Iran | The Guardian

3 Likes