Imagine that Gerrard can’t win games without Beale running the show behind the scenes.
Doesn’t mean shit? You literally contradicted yourself by saying Klopp learnt from Wolfgang Frank and Arrigo Sacchi, the modern fatherers of “pressing” football.
Just because Rodgers failed, doesn’t mean that broardering your horizons as a young manager is a bad thing.
Not really sure why such the aggressive tone.
No agressive tone.
Klopp doesn’t actually contradict what i’m saying which is that he learned from his former boss, something that i’m sure Gerrard has been doing his whole career from a variety of good to great managers.
Klopp states clearly Frank was a mentor to him, which is completly different to working as a player under different managers.
And Gerrard who threw a tantrum because Benitez wouldn’t play him as a center mid, and then went on to have his best season as a right midfielder? 
It’s still managers in England, there is a wealth of knowledge around the world - Look at Beale he went to Brazil and picked up some really good ideas.
No doubt that Stevie can now take his time, both to rest a little bit but also travel, get new knowledge, meet new people, etc. I still expect him to give it a good go, no doubt.
You can learn thing from somebody without them being called a mentor.
All I’m saying is there are examples of managers talking about studying the game and failing at the top level and there are managers like Klopp and Guardiola who went from players to managers in the set-up of one club.
There is no set guaranteed path. I’m not sure I remember ever reading about Dalglish’s trips to Spain and Brazil to study but he managed okay
Kenny who was a player manager first? Now you are just being a wum.
Important context is that coaches like Potter and Rodgers have to take these tours to learn about these approaches and how they are implemented because of their lack of playing careers. Someone like Gerrard shouldn’t because he’s lived it as part of his primary career. Even by never leaving Liverpool (ignoring MLS) he’s seen a variety of styles and philosophies, enough to shape his vision of how football needs to be played, with the added value of understanding the limitations of how players experience these ideas.
The issue is, as a player how much was he intellectualizing these things? How much can he take from those experiences as a player and implement it himself? Based on most of the way his career went (calling for Rafa to be replaced, and with Curbishley at that) suggests not. And the fact we know he wasnt taking it in on that level then is the reason why people who are skeptical of him feel that way. Doesnt mean he cannot turn it around, and maybe there is a big epiphany that then makes him an even better student, but almost everything that has come out of his mouth as a manager is reflective of the player Gerrard (talking about playing standards, there is only so much a manager can do) indicating maybe those lessons just arent going to resonate with him
4 Likes
How is it being a wum pointing out that some world class managers didn’t travel the world studying the techniques of other leagues?
And that some managers who do, don’t actually emulate them anyway.
Don’t worry, it seems anyone who disagrees with them is a WUM.
Wear it like a badge of honour.
This is why I’m not that keen on him being a coach.
A lot of his greatest strengths were due to his instinct and raw physical ability. Tactical discipline wasn’t one of them.
1 Like
Generally, isn’t it somewhat rare for someone who is a standout player to later make an excellent manager? It’s like being touched by stardust twice. Pep Guardiola is something of an outlier there. The best managers seem to have been journeyman players. What other “great” players have gone on to standout managerial careers?
Definitely the set up at Brighton is very good which is a bonus for a manager going in.
Very interesting and insightful to the character of Potter. This attitude has stood to him and you can clearly tell he knows what he’s about and how to get his teams playing the way he wants.
Not something we can say of many managers, Gerrard included.
Both ways work for some and not for others but right now Gerrard has a lot of work to do if he wishes to be a manager of a top team.
Not really. The list of successful managers with good playing careers is extensive. One of the differentiating factors though appears to be what made the player a good player. Someone like gerrard was a force of nature. He made things happen probably without even he himself understanding how he did it. That does not translate. Someone like Alonso though spent his entire life thinking deeply about the game, trying to understand how it was played. His dad was a Spanish international mutliple la liga winner and that platform meant that by the time he broke into senior football at Sociedad as an 18 year old he was already reading the game like a veteran.
When you look at managers like Capello, Ancelotti, Zidane, Deschamps, Pep, Beckenbauer, Mancini, that is the commonality among them - success as a player without much notably stand out athleticism that made the game easy for them. You get the odd one like Simone and Conte whose success was more based on Gerrard like physical prowess, but these guys have been successful seemingly by finding a way to pull that level of commitment out of their players, Most players like that who go into management seem to think they can sit back and just expect other (lesser) players to find it in themselves and then dont understand why they’re not all performing the way he remembers himself performing.
3 Likes
That’s my point, the jump to mid-table Prem level was too far so Stevie should be considering what his shortcomings are and going out and developing them. An example used is the one of travelling and seeing coaching methods around the world, it’s not the only thing clearly.
Wasn’t it him and Carragher pushing Hodgson ahead of Ancelotti (or someone else) as well? Seems he has an affinity for British! So horizons need broadening.
I was always a bit surprised he didn’t at least spend a year as a coach under Klopp so he could see first hand everything from one of the greats.
I totally get your point, but I think my point is you’re asking a car to become a bicycle.
Potter and Rodgers picked up these things at an age when Gerrard was being equally exposed to the same quality of ideas. There is something about the respective people that made some of them take it and others not (in gerrard’s case he spent a significant part of his career actively pushing back on tactical ideas he wasnt familiar with).
So I’d say its his perspective that likely needs broadening not his horizons. In some ways he’s like a person who has travelled the world without actually seeing anything. Travelling the world again wont change that unless you commit to seeing things the second time around. So what appears to be missing is an internal thing that isnt going to be solved by simply doing things to gain more experience.
3 Likes
Agreed maybe a change of scenery could be the catalyst for that. He’s spent all his life in England/Scotland.
Stevie might be the best footballing brain in the world… He might be ahead of his time with the tactics he wants to adopt… He might be the most ambitious and determined ex-player there ever was… BUT, if he is piss-poor at getting his point across or awful at inspiring people to play for him… He ain’t ever going to make it as a supreme coach…
They say it takes 3 types of combined authority to become a great leader
Authority of Knowledge
Authority of Position
and what I think is the most important one of all…
Authority of Personality
How many of us hang on every work Jurgen says and absorb the common-sense meaning of what he is talking about…
How many of us do the same with Stevie…? Well not me for one
The footballing side of things might not be the problem with SG… it might be other aspects of what makes a manager complete is what he needs to improve upon… Just saying is all
Interesting. Not sure I would agree 100% though.
As a player he’d be focused on the session and what he needs to do as opposed to the wider concept of the session and how it affects the team as a whole. I believe that would be the case with the majority of players.
I wonder if he suffers a bit of the Hoddle, Keane and Souness syndrome, ie unable to accept the players are not at their level and are expecting them to carry out something the player simply is not capable of.
1 Like