Not many on this forum thought it was a good idea at the time, and two of its major proponents are no longer on the forum.
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So, would you vote for a return into the EU if you had the chance?
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I didnāt vote to leave in the first place.
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Well, given that Brexit is the main reason I no longer live in the UK, Iād jump at the chance. Whether the sort of people that thought Polish builders are the reason that they donāt have suitable housing would want to go back in is another matter.
Realistically, rejoining the EU is a somewhat more complicated process than restarting a Netflix subscription (which is what many pro-EU people seem to give the impression of). However, joining the Customs Union and even the Single Market are more easily achievable and would have most of the benefits.
Military co-operation is an interesting one, because it would be in everyoneās interests and it is an area where the UK still has a fair bit of leverage and couple ease any accession process.
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Depends on the deal being honest. Utterly stupid thing to have done in the first place. We are not getting back what was lost.
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The UK was the major reason there was no military co-operation in Europe before Brexit. I can not see the UK changing that stance above all after their recent sucking up to Trump.
A joint Franco-anglais command might have alleviated some of the worries about a France led force.
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Yes, pig-headedly so. But it is still one area of leverage that the UK retains. Unfortunately, since Brexit, the UK holds very few of the cards.
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Try 800-5000. Not the entire army obviously.
The idea, forced by the US decision to leave Europe in a very rapid and hostile manner and serve all the poker cards to Russia, is to set up a European joint force. Itās not realistic yet, but this is to get the snowball rolling. I am skeptical, because neither the UK populace nor the general European populace has woken up and smelled the coffee yet. Severely increased defence budgets and rearmament is needed, but there will be (as seen in the UK labour party now, clinging to unrealistically low 2.5 % gdp spending despite the critical events of the last few weeks and the chasm staring at us) much opposition and I am pessimistic.
In short, I think not enough will actually materialise and that we are close to fucked. Well, some of us at least.
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The likelyhood of that increases in parallel to time spent with the head in the sand.
But of course, one can do nothing, ignore the US and Trump, let Russia just win, and then face a revitalised revanchist imperial Great Power alone in 3-5 years without proper rearmament to deter it. That sounds like suicide for Europe to me though.
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Guess thatās whatās going to happen then.
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Iām quite pessimistic, but clinging to some minor hope.
The actions of European governments in the next couple of months and their ability to get their head out of the sand and rapidly enact highly politically unpopular crisis solutions, will reveal much of the future in terms of geopolitics and security for our continent.
Sending troops to guard cease fire in UKR for instance, will be very unpopular because it carries a real risk of entanglement. Continental Rearmament will be met by screaming protests and lots of āeveryone should pay but usā.
I donāt think either the UK, France or Germany are able to pay these monitary, political and economical costs really.
For one, any decision to send troops to UKR must have cross party mandate. No more Cons against Labour or visa versa, but unified policy. Any serious action requires deep rooting in parliament and for political games to cease. You cannot play political games with something so important, you need true madate from governance parties (such as a deal/pact between Labour, Cons and Lib Dems). As an example. You cannot do anything like this with a threat of an election changing the policy. See US for example of the opposite. So it must have mandate from parties normally hostile to each other, like in the 30s.
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Yeah, we were all so lucky that World War 2 started in good economic timesā¦
The West has had 3+ generations of minimal sacrifice. That is coming to an end.
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I agree. but forgive me, because I am not optimistic. We have already wasted 3 years, with people like me screaming into the void, warning about the impending, rather to me, obvious danger. But little has happened and now we are almost out of time
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I think a vote to return to the EU would pass comfortably now, but the Elephant in the room is whether the EU would have us back.
They have been clear that there is no return for us until the argument is resolved for at least a generation. They donāt want us acting like itās the Hokey Cokey.
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I thought the uk defence budget was already forecast to increase 10-20% over the next couple of years?
Noises are that Starmer is trying to push higher spending through but the challenge for the government is that the narrative around its finances are such that doing so will be difficult - although justifying the breaking of a manifesto commitment (not increasing income tax) to fund it could be an interesting gamble.
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Amateur. Iāve been screaming about Climate Change for 20 years and no-one has done a thing!
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Starmer is getting criticised for refusing to raise defence spending. Heāll get criticised when we have to put up taxes to pay for it.
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I did and still do
Thatās what I am talkng about. The narrative should obviously change when the premise change, but no. I read about Labour MPs saying loudly āNo! We were elected on 2.5% so no more!ā, totally ignoring the events after Trump won.
Absolute Head in Sand. The very definition of it. These people lack so much knowledge and do not understand that this is deeply serious.
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