UK Politics Thread (Part 4)

[Dane]

@cynicaloldgit

Nope. I know how to spell.

I also know which PM has been the biggest embarrassment in the history of the country.

Could be a photo finish in 2029

[cynicaloldgit]

Doubt it.

I’m no fan of Starmer’s, but he’s got a long way to go to be as bad as Bozo.

[redfanman]

@Rambler

I would put up income tax…I can never understand why that is always sancrosanct.

In this case probably because it was a key manifesto commitment not to increase income tax. Given they had also promised to increase spending on defence and the manifesto was ‘costed’ it would likely not go down well amongst voters and would just open the government up to accusations of lying on virtually everything they do for the rest of this Parliament.

It might even lead to splits within the party by MPs who either dislike the direction of the leadership anyway or who feel that such a move has cost them their job at the next election.

[cynicaloldgit]

@redfanman

it was a key manifesto commitment not to increase income tax.

Which is an example of how far the political landscape has been pulled to the right by the neoliberal agenda.

No proper Labour government should be afraid of putting up income tax… especially when most polls show that the public are not averse to income tax rises IF the revenue is spent on health and education.

[Noo_Noo]

Should have put a whopping wealth tax of some description in place. It would not have broken the manifesto promise not to tax normal working people.

They seem terrified of doing this but it’s becoming the only real option.

[cynicaloldgit]

@Noo_Noo

Should have put a whopping wealth tax of some description in place

But that would drive all the chancers, I mean wealth creators, offshore.

The country would be fucked!

[redfanman]

@Noo_Noo

Should have put a whopping wealth tax of some description in place.

Its probably not something that can be done that quickly given the likely complexity of the tax.

[Noo_Noo]

Yes that’s fair. .

I could see it being a very complex piece of legislation. Increasing Capital gains maybe?

[redfanman]

@Noo_Noo

Increasing Capital gains maybe?

That’s already happening. Reeves announced at the budget that Basic rate tax payers will pay 18% instead of 10% and higher rate tax payers will pay 24% instead of 20%. I think that the rate changes came in immediately too.

There has also been changes announced to stamp duty on second homes, ending of the stamp duty holiday, chsnges to inheritance of pensions, the vat on school fees and i think further cuts to how much income from dividends you can earn before paying tax on it.

[Mascot]

The shitshow yesterday in the White House should be a clarion call to the rest of the world. Isolate this orange cunt, and start forging closer links with Europe.

If this country has two brain cells to rub together, rejoining the EU shouldn’t even be a discussion. It should just be happening.

[Noo_Noo]

I would honestly love to ask the most ardent of brexit supporter on who we should align ourselves with.

[SBYM]

Oven. Ready.

[RedSeven]

I’d be fairly sure a large chunk of them would say America

[redfanman]

@Mascot

If this country has two brain cells to rub together, rejoining the EU shouldn’t even be a discussion. It should just be happening.

Playing devils advocate here but UK staying outside of the EU may allow it to avoid being dragged into any conflict should Russia go after other former soviet states. Also might minimise the risk of tariffs that disrupt the UK economy further (not saying whether or not that is a good thing but it is a valid train of thought).

[RedWhippet]

@redfanman

staying outside of the EU may allow it to avoid being dragged into any conflict should Russia go after other former soviet states.

The British Army already has around 900 personnel based in Estonia, so that is already out of the window. Realistically, security is better secured by being in a wide ranging alliance.

[redfanman]

@RedWhippet

The British Army already has around 900 personnel based in Estonia, so that is already out of the window. Realistically, security is better secured by being in a wide ranging alliance.

I dont know the terms of that arrangement, but they could just be pulled?

(Again not advocating for this position, but i can see some people supporting it).

[RedWhippet]

Well the run-and-hide option is always there I suppose.

[Noo_Noo]

@RedSeven

I’d be fairly sure a large chunk of them would say America

And my response would then be “Russia then?”

[Lynch04]

@redfanman

Well, it would obviously depend on terms of that deal and how permanent that deal is viewed as being (a deal that may end following a change of government at the next election is less likely to see significant gains in trade/ investment than one that is supported by any party likely to govern in the UK).

But generally speaking, as countries do usually do most of their trade with neighbouring countries, and removing or lowering barriers to trade is known to boost trade, I think it is fair to predict it would lead to more trade and be of benefit the UK economy than not having a deal.

Please note, my comment was of the belief that rejoining the EU would not improve trade massively. I am not questioning tgat it may/would improve trade.
I completely with the logic you presented above but it is not as simple as that. There are a lot more contributing factors.
The UK has predominantly imported more than it exports to the EU, so who benefits from Tariffs? Does the UK and EU not have a TCA which has 0% Tariffs on trade (depending on country of origin).
Is the US not suggesting Tariffs of 25% with the EU? Yes, we may suffer the same fate but have the chance to negotiate on an individual basis.
How is trade going for the EU in general, particularly Germany? The Market share of the EU Zone has been declining since 2002. Germany’s economy is predominantly Manufacturing based, it has been hit severely with the shift to Electric cars.

The problem is, too many of us focus on the UK’s problems without comparing it to international trends.

The IMF forecasts the UK economy to be the 3rd fastest growing in the G7 at 1.6% above the Eurozone at 1% and Germany at 0.3%.
The UK’s GDP in Q4 2024 was 3.2% above its pre-pandemic levels, Germany was -0.1%.

Again, my opinion, but with the Worlds ever growing reliance on cheap products from China. The UK being a predominantly service based economy (New Labour initiative) may actually be in a good position going forward internationally.

[Lynch04]

@Noo_Noo

Seriously, after all that crap, I’m not going to bother anymore. I’d have a more fruitful conversation with a tree.

If your conversation was to be with an apple (insert other fruit) tree, then yes I cannot disagree. I would however, feel sorry for said tree.