Both can be true at the same time. But maybe they should have been left to continue the mess thry made.
Starmer has lost the UK I feel.
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The problem is that you cannot call their voters racist. A large segment of them are working class that Labour may not get to vote for them in the next election, but must some how get back later down the line. And with Reform polling so high, winning back the low-educated working class is absolutely vital. But I donât know how, but I do know that you cement their positions and make them defensive by labeling them racist. Many of them are, but many of them also donât think they are or realise it and many are actually not. These voters, the less extreme ones, must be won back and not pushed into swimming along with the main stream of the FĂźhrer Fish. Never underestimate the power of Group Thinking and Mass Suggestion. It can lead otherwise nice enough people into dark movements. By labeling them, you cement their position in the movement, I think.
I certainly donât underestimate the power of Group Thinking and Mass Suggestion. Itâs already evident in everyday life, especially when people are being fed propaganda by politicians and the influential media.
But, I donât believe that people will necessarily be alienated by being told certain things. Letâs imagine those who are truly bigoted and racist. Will they be upset to be called that? No, theyâll very likely revel in it anyway. So, what about the decent but misguided souls who canât see the truth? They may well be upset to be called racist for thinking of voting in support of such policies, but if they are truly decent and understanding, then itâs likely to be a wake up call.for them, rather than cementing that position. If they truly hadnât realised it before then their eyes would be opened and theyâd have no excuse for not understanding.
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Yes, I donât know the answer myself sadly. It is so complicated 
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I find this all depressing. The country has gone to sh*t and we are economically bankrupt. Yet the politics of the day is to win elections and power. Labour are in (maybe the most incompetent government ever) but instead of have a strategy they knee jerk to fight off reform. Conservatives find a policy to try to beat both. They had a huge majority and wasted it.
None of it is a long term plan. None of it fixes the issues.
Last people to really try? Whether you liked the politics or not was new Labour or Thatcher..
Mabe first past the post has to go? But who will agree to that! Turkeys and Christmas. I despair. I care but feel disempowered. Short of run for PM what can I do?
Itâs a far bigger issue than the UK alone. The wealth is being sucked out of normal people pretty much everywhere and distributed to a few people / entities.
The only thing I can think is that something snaps somewhere and only then do you get an opportunity to reset.
Before then its fighting over the last dregs and how quickly it moves.
Is the price of the snap too high? Which government is going to come in on "things are going to get worse for the next 20-30 years while the policy kicks in⌠Governments will do everything to kick the âsnapâ down the line - since forever. I cannot see it changing. The destination for most developed countries is likely set. Just sit enjoy the slide!
p.s. not sure why I feel so grey - am usually a glass half full (unless its my beer) guy
Yes almost definitely. It already is and we arent there yet.
Some will, others will accelerate us towards it as they seek to pull the last ounces of wealth out.
I guess iâm kind of in a similar place to yourself. I just dont see anything that turns this ship around until those with the most start to eat each other, or people really turn on them.
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Have you had your memory of the last 15 years wiped?
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Iâll rate Cameron and Osbourne as competent. They achieved exactly what they set out to do.
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Cameron didnât want Brexit.
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And as soon as he lost the referendum, he fucked off to let others deal with the shitshow that followed.
If he was half half as decent a leader as he thought he was, he would not have folded to his backbench like the spineless worm he is.
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Tru dat.
I suppose even Boris Johnson met his main KPI of âbeing able to say Boris Johnson was Prime Minister.â Big tick there.
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Dum dum de dum dum, bom bom bom.
Austerity?
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I think the last Tory leader not to fold to their back bench was John Major. They brought him down instead.
Actually, the same could be said of Theresa May.
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To be fair to Cameron, the main reason he stepped down was because he was aware that the Brexit wing of the party were going to challenge his leadership within the next few months and he had little chance of surviving that.
He also felt that a number of those he thought close to him had betrayed him in the run up to the vote.
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I think May was responsible for her own downfall. She was repeatedly folding to her backbench on Brexit (even voting against her own bill).
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Calling an election and losing her majority didnât help.
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