Russian newspapers view of trump and Greenland, via the bbcs russia correspondent
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Utterly deranged yet again. Also, how is it possible that no European stateman is saying that if any country were to make a move for Greenland, itâd be NATOâs responsibility to defend it and not just Denmarkâs? Since, you know Greenland is part of Denmark and Denmark is a NATO member.
He truly isnât right in the head; someone should commit him.
Does it matter? The voicing of this possibility is pretty much proof that there is no rule of law that is absolute.
Are moving towards the Dark Forest path? Know your place!
It doesnât work like that- NATO requires assent from all and the US is a founding member.
What will happen is that a US take over of Greenland will not make NATO go out with a bang, but it would fizzle out (powerful forces in Europe would also fight tooth and nail against this, as there is currently no security alternative to the US and what we, including Denmark, really are worried about, is Russia). You cannot use NATO to defend against a member, certainly not the US, sadly.
Crucial translation of the article from Norwegian:
At least we in Scandinavia know that all of this is a side show, and that the greatesty threat, apart from the end of NATO, is the loss of focus visa vi Russia and itâs brutal war of conquest.
I see some in this thread, seemingly making that dire mistake and hope itâs not true for our actual leaderships in EUR.
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I know, I should have worded it better. What I meant to say is that Trumpâs argument of China or Russia attempting to gain control of Greenland is nonsensical. In such a case, NATO would respond.
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Is there a country (government) in Europe that is sufficiently far sighted and strong willed that it will make a stand at the expense of power?
Ultimately it seems that w/o Germany, Europe is no where and Germany will likely go to the ends of the earth to seek stability and preserve their trading status quo.
edit: p.s. ironically, is the only option regime change in the US?
I donât know and it worries me a whole fucking lot. Basically there is no single question in the world today that worries me more. Itâs difficult, scary and unpredictable to witness.
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Iâm confused. Making a stand against who? Russia or the US?
Because the post you reacted to was about Greenland/US shenanigans being just a sideshow, with Russia being the real threat. Not sure the trading status quo with Russia is at the forefront of German leaders thoughts right now tbh.
in your first post on this forum you wroteâŚ
"This is just a quick hello from a first time poster.Iâm a bit of a refugee who clambered into my small boat to escape another forum that has descended into anarchy and is ruled over by rebel posters who preach hate and are intolerant of any views that donât concur with theirs"
out of interest, what hate was been preached, and what views were the other posters intolerant of that didnt concur with theirs?
it wasnt anything to do with Russia was it?
just askingâŚ
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The Ukrainian Liverpool fan sites are notorious for that
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Russia is a threat - that is clear. For Europe, standing up to Russia is only possible with the backing of the US. If the US wants to trade continuance of the back-stop with acquiring Greenland - well, who will say no. Meanwhile all the other countries will be making the calculation and part of it will be will the larger countries stand up to be counted? Likely not and Europe will give in.
It is not an easy choice for any country.
The waters are very muddyâŚ
I understood his post to allude to a security organisation without the US, which would be extremely costly in the short term and for a period, we would be very weak and vulnerable while we build up.
So I guess, to stand up to both (which is rather important).
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However, it is the likely best path forward, but the problem is the time scale, it is too narrow for us (i.e US pushing divorce when we are not at all ready). But like Denmark says, we donât have to be as strong as NATO with the US, just stronger than Russia. There is a real road to go there though, since while we are much richer, we are far weaker, and to cite Lithuania yesterday, we need one organised command and control, not 20 small banzai armies. While our 20 armies in pure theory is as strong as Russia, that is not reality the way we have organised defence in Europe under National Commands.
Without the US, we must move from what is to something far more integrated or we are fucked.
The problem is that Trump and the US is moving so fucking fast down the road of no return, too fast for us to counter, it seems.
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Didnt macron and Meloni recently say something along the lines that europe will have to talk to putin soon ( because of whats happening across the waters)
Yes, because leaving talking to Putin to Trump seems rather ill advised, so I get that.
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This
Right now we look like a fucking free lunch to the predators, of whom Putin is by far the most dangerous for European states. They will literally invade, subjugate and eradicate our cultures if they can get away with it.
I say âourâ, but itâs clear who is in the firing line in the first few years of imperial expansion. It is several smaller European sovreign states; all of whom we are obligated to defend (but maybe we wonât without NATO, this is the problem, without NATO security guarantees, what is even there, as there is no other security pact on the table in the short term and no talk about it) and the Russian predator would be a fool not to exploit the crisis with the US as much as possible (and will, given that Trump is directly working in Russiaâs interests geopolitically).
At the very least, we need to stall this as long as possible, if only to have time to get some more Realpolitik strenght to defend and/or counter with.
A gift article worth reading (imo):
https://x.com/JonLemire/status/2013272465682694276
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https://x.com/shashj/status/2013139238145900974
That is actually a problem. Escalation dominance that is. EUR has cards, but it is so fucking exensive to play them because it would be incredibly escalatory and many still hope this rift is some how still temporary. If EUR retaliates and used financial sanctions, it would not be temporary and then the US would become a foe. Not that easy this to navigate exactly. We are in a hellish bind (also, some states, like the UK, would follow the US in any case, creating the rift of Putinâs dreams).
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Meanwhile, Trump continues with invitations to the new friends of the US, to join his Gaza board
https://x.com/maxseddon/status/2013243403954241553
Vladimir and Alexandr.
https://x.com/Jonpy99/status/2013315682675388578
Too True. Because this spy thriller sucks and has an implausible plot that no one would have believed in 2015
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