Errrrrr… no he isn’t.
Whoever gets the job, they’ll inherit two things: a decent squad and a lot of unrealistic expectations.
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When the going gets tough…the tough get going. Or so to speak.
Also Danny Mills is a massive wanker, people like him are the reasons I’ll never get behind this country in Football.
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I guess the fact Ive been dogging our CBs and GK options earlier in the thread make it less clear that Im rejecting the idea that our players arent “good enough”. The way I reconcile that is that the defining characteristic of international football these days is teams that are incomplete. Every team in this tournament bar France and Brazil, and maybe Portugal, have at least one role for which they don’t have the players and their challenge is then coming up with a team selection that mitigates that weakness. More often than not though managers are left with no other option than just picking what as available and rolling the dice and hoping the Gods are favouring them for a couple of weeks. Tournament football shows us over and over again that the Gods like fucking fans.
For as well discussed as England’s issues at CB and GK are, Croatia have a half a side of players of this caliber. Their results at the subsequent 2 National League tournament and Euros (two tournaments in which they lost to England) probably reflect that reality better than these world cups runs. So while I don’t think it’s reasonable to put that success down to simply having better players you’d be a fool if you didnt look at it and try to take something from it. What exactly that is I dont know, but I’d imagine it’s least partly related to a more accepting view both from within and without to accept this limitation exists. That probably means from the players and manager a more pragmatic way of playing to mitigate their weaknesses and exentuate their strengths. It probably means a fairer response from the fans in having to go to penalties to get passed a side as limited as Denmark. Most of all though it means that when you have a couple of competitions in a row where you dont do great you dont get pressure to rip it all up and start again while pretending there is some magic solution based on just replacing player x with player y as success at these tournaments is far more capricious than that.
International tournament football is unpredictable and progression in tournaments is rarely as simple as just having players who are “good enough”. Croatia have put on a masterclass in the last 2 world cups of not losing games and that has seen them get to two semis, possibly 2 finals, but it’s also required them to lean on penalties to squeeze past some very ordinary teams, often after a drab low scoring affair. I think lots of the people praising them for the quality of their players forget the nature of their respective runs in those tournaments and overlook the results they’ve had in the periods in between, which are credible but far more in line with what you’d expect of a side that has only about 5 top level players.
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100% with you there. And as you said there are other unsavoury hanger-ons around team Ingerland
Results aside, which sometimes England got better and sometimes Croatia…
England are a better coached side than Croatia. That is clear in last years, it’s not even difficult to see.
Our strength comes from having usually (though not always of course) a high quality midfield and then a few more important players through the spine. Having much less expectation and pressure. Having perhaps players who learned football on the streets. Technically gifted and wanting to show that we can mix it with the best. And yeah, possibly having that motivation/atmosphere bit that comes with being a young little country.
This is not the first time we’re doing it. Nobody is subscribed to constant success and especially not Croatia. But when you do it a few times in a short span, with different teams, under different coaches, then it’s not a one off (full credit to the tournament Greece won!) anymore. We can start talking about certian culture, standard and way that is being followed. But our FA has plenty of “stories” as well. Infrastructure is poor, comparing to the success of the national side. We don’t invest nowhere near enough in sport.
I’ve known better quality England sides player per player, but then those sides weren’t functioning as well as these last few. Could it be better? Sure. But I don’t think that a better coach than Southgate necessarily goes further than him in tournaments. Similar, same or a bit better? Possible. Who would be that man? I don’t know. Then we would also talk about fine margins. Look at Brazil, went out in two QF’s in a row.
Look at France, who for a good decade were: a) not good enough, b) not well organized, c) had scandals popping out left, right and centre. Deschamps totally changed that with years and years of consistent work. It’s not like they cruised without problems all the time. International football is different to club elite football, must be viewed/evaluated in different context.
England will get there at some point, I’m sure. There’s nothing impossible or cursed or whatever. Others can laugh, joke, but seriously talking, nobody can convince me that there’s no possibility of high quality talent “growing” in England. And then creating a side or sides that can win things at senior level.
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I agree with you there. Danny Mills, on his best day, was crap. As a pundit he is worse.
Still, on a personal note, I can’t let shite like him stop me from wanting my country to do well. I’m not a gushing Englander. Just that come the World Cup or Euros I will look on England and get drawn in, somewhat.
LFC is my enduring love affair. Always will be.
But as for England and international football, the likes of Mills, Ferdinand, and numerous other nonentities, won’t impact me.
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I would not take any notice of this, Fwat Fwank is the peoples favourite. 
Managing England is a strange thing. We have had some top class managers and got nowhere. And then very modest fare, like Southgate, who has done better.
Whether Southgate remains or someone else takes over, it all leaves me with a bit of a shoulder shrug. We might get a better club manager in, say Pochettino, but what’s to say he won’t go the way of previous high profile foreign managers and get nowhere? Or it might be someone like Eddie Howe, who decides he wants to be an honest man?
In Pochettino he did very well at Spurs. Made the CL final do or die, so it came to an end. Managed big clubs after that, but didn’t do as well. There was a sense he was waiting for Man a Utd, but the timing didn’t work out, and now they have Ten Hag. So maybe Poch might like to keep his profile high with an England stint?
Anyway, back to Southgate - when he spoke of a difficult 18 months, what was he talking about?
A high profile job like England manager will always have a circus around it - you have to play the game, somewhat, in terms of media obligations - but surely the England manager would have enough about them to be able to ignore it?
Leaders lead. Those in the hot seat, in any endeavor, know. Those who comment on their work are ten a penny.
With talent available to any England manager chosen from the 100mph full thrust PL… Every other NT should be really weary of going up against Engerlund…
Can’t remember that last England manager that went for broke against most teams, including even the ‘so-called’ minnows of the international stage…
Southgate has had long enough to stamp his mark into the annals of footballing history… Too bad he hasn’t stretched himself to do so because even after his stint… People are still going to think he is a crap manager…!
Read an article yesterday that made me chuckle… Guy said
“I Pity the fans down in the Championship at the moment, because imagine knowing Southgate is going to be appointed to one these clubs soon - and you are just hoping with fingers crossed it is not going to be yours” :0)
Like I said… he has had a chance to shine… to date, he has not won any medals for anyone…!
I would not be in favour of another foreign manager after the experience with Sven and Capello. That’s not a jingoistic thing, but more a reflection on how toxic the job is and what is needed to stand up to that.
Both Sven and Capello seemed to end their time in the role by phoning it in. By acquiescing to the press and public pressure to play the most favoured players rather than putting out the side they thought had the best chance to win. It was like they both concluded the shit they would get for trying and failing was not worth it so it was easier to just take their lucrative salary and serve up what the press wanted safe in the knowledge that “failing” in that role was unlikely to hurt their international reputation. I think to overcome that toxicity the job needs someone who wants to win stuff for their own personal reasons as much as the players do and I don’t think we’ll find that by going back down the high priced, high profile foreigner path.
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On a more serious note, seems the squad did not leave Qatar empty handed. Is this the famous cat tossed by Brazil? And what is this weird thing between cats and footballers?
Different cat I beleive.
It was hanging around the England team hotel, and had a knack for wandering in shot in the middle of players being interviewed
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There will be a little kid somewhere in Qatar looking for their cat after it escaped through an open window about 3 weeks ago…!
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I see the media are mentioning the likes of Howe and Potter. That’s all fine, but would they leave their current jobs to takeover England? I don’t think so. We’ll see what happens with Potter though if this doesn’t work out at Chelsea, we know how “patient” they are. They are also reporting that Tuchel wants to remain in club football for now. Pochettino might be more of an option if England want to go down the “whoever, just get quality” route.
Can Dave play full back at City?
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Probably not.
He’s not worth £50M
He might get a start by a whisker…
Taxi…
Not commited to the job Gareth? Then fuck off.
I’m sure he will stay. He’s just trying to get some attention, checking his market value, maybe wants to check if some clubs will make first contact with him.
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