I think you’re right with Brad. Had we kept him he (assuming he still hit the same levels he went on to hit) would have solved many of our goalkeeping over the following 10 - 15 years! I agree we missed a trick there, but I still for the life of me don’t remember him being any good while he was with us. To be fair I was an early teen then, so maybe you remember better than me. I just Googled it and between 1997 and 2000 he only played 31 matches for us. Kelleher played well over 60 and won us trophies (league cups) and contributed heavily (for a second choice) to league matches in 2 title winning seasons. Still don’t see how Friedel can possibly be higher or seen as better. If he was that good he would absolutely have displaced David James who was so erratic!! (through his whole career, not just for us) - As you rightly say he was capable of looking brilliant, but a bit like Ibou at CB now, he was never too far away from a massive fuck up that costs us dearly.
I’m rating Friedel over his career, not just the tiny bit we saw at Liverpool. In terms of what they did at Liverpool, I completely agree that Kelleher did more than Friedel. And with many years left on the clock, Kelleher has every chance to move up the rankings.
He was as good a number two that you could hope for, and when called upon, Kelleher did very well for us in goal. He was too good for a back up role and now we’ll see what he does. He has a decent mid ranking Prem team in Brentford, and it is a case of so far so good for him.
Adrian was our backup in our 19/20 title winning season, he played 11 league games.
I forgot him! I tried to remember all the keepers since Clemence.
That is true actually, just checked. But even that aside he contributed a lot to our trophy haul.
It is always an interesting conversation comparing players from different eras. I have seen all the keepers mentioned play from Tommy Lawrence onwards. Difficult to know how Tommy and Ray Clemence would have fared in the modern game with the huge emphasis on distribution skills. Clem and Tommy were of the one bounce and hoof it up the pitch era. Also Tommy was less than 6ft tall which would have been a huge disadvantage now. Clem was a great collector of crosses but in far less crowded areas.
Reina was a big favourite of the fans but for me rather overrated…
Good point about the demands across generations. It’s a different job now to what Clemence knew (unfortunately I don’t remember Lawrence).
Of, course we’ll never know. But I think that’s the wrong question, the better one in those past vs present topics would be; how would their talent as foundation fare in today’s game if they were born, trained and used modern times. For me, most great players from the past would be also great today if their talent was worked with in today’s techniques.
To be fair I’m kind of with David James on this one. Saw an interview, with Simon Jordan I think it was? He was asked if his era of keepers could play in the modern game and he was a bit dismissive of the whole concept of it being difficult. His point was playing out from the back is mostly just rolling the ball to a full back or centre back 10 yards away. Now someone like Ederson obviously plays on another level to most keepers in this regard, but Jamo said for the most part it’s really not that hard!! He’s right to be fair. The problem comes in the next phase - keeper passes to full back who passes square to centre back - oh fuck under pressure - back to full back - oh bollocks 2 players running at me full speed - back to keeper - fuck everyone is running at me - hoofs it upfield under pressure and gives the ball straight to the opposition. I don’t watch masses of other teams on TV but the games I do see, this happens time and time again these days in the prem. Most keepers just wack it and get rid at this point because the back 4 are not good enough to play this way, but the manager insists on doing it. I think the Ederson, Kelleher and to a certain extent Alisson type keepers are a bit more composed generally in this circumstance. I think that’s the difference. I think most keepers from the old days could roll a ball 10 - 15 yards to an unmarked full back, but I am not convinced that too many keepers now are that good at ‘playing out from the back’ under pressure.
He was another colossus of that era boy could we need someone like him. All the successful Liverpool teams of the past had a pair of giants at CH and that solidity at the back permeated to the rest of the team. The crucial signing in the summer should have a pair of CHs of decent quality and pedigree. Klopp had the same problems in his tenure when he was in charge we even relied on two academy players in Rhys Williams and Nat Philips to help us finish third in the league.
Phillips was 23 when he made his debut after 2 loan spells with Stuttgart. Hardly an academy player. Williams was 19 and had already been out on loan too.
Ogrizovic! Did well at Coventry. Good cricketer too.
Takumi Minamino has been scoring a few goals recently. Today’s goal against PSG. (I think he got one in the CL on Tuesday/Wednesday).
He often bagged them for us in the league cup to be fair. I liked him a lot when he got the chance to play.
I liked Reina but, if my memory is correct on this, he had a nightmare in a derby at Goodison, which we lost 3-0. I remember his performance that day, being similar to the the one in the Champions League final, that finished Karius’s career.
Pepe did make mistakes, but to be fair so does Alisson and everyone else. That particular one was where he sort of caught it, threw it at an Everton player and then tried to give him a black eye rather than block the ball as he headed it into the goal as I recall…I might have to Youtube it later as I’m possibly misremembering.
The whole Reina debate is really not that important anyway (even though I started it on this thread) as however you look at it, he is clearly either our second or (in my opinion) 3rd best keeper of the last 35 years behind Alisson and with Kelleher somewhere close. The rest have varied from generally adequate with some good moments to absolute fucking dogshit!
The Karius one is interesting for me as people say that one performance ended his time with us, he was absolute crap from day 1. I remember at the time people being excited that we signed a young up and coming German keeper - but now we know why his club let him go for 4m or whatever it was. Mignolet was pretty poor a lot of the time too, but a better keeper than Karius without a doubt. We have had some absolute dross between the sticks and I don’t think we’ll ever have it as good as peak Alisson with Kelleher as his understudy. Has there ever been a better 1-2 in prem history? (excluding the short term things like Chelsea bringing Courtois back to take Cech’s place before he swiftly moved on, so for a brief time they had them both in the squad)
To be fair, it’s the first time in that I hear someone comparing Reina to Kelleher, having Pepe behind or it being close.
Karius had a pretty good period until Kiev. Klopp changed that position a few times between 2016 and 2018, I didn’t alway agree with his choice either way. I remember in 16/17, one of Karius’ first serious performances was our disappointing League Cup semi-final exit to Southampton (when we struggled to score against Puel’s side in 4 successive games against them). Particularly the first leg, he managed to keep the score -1, but we couldn’t turn it around at Anfield.
Kiev was obviously a horror show, but no, it wasn’t crap all the time. Especially leading up to it in 17/18. It couldn’t have been, with the results and progress we had.
To be honest, I can’t remember the other games Karius played for us. It’s probably an age thing. I just recall that one game putting an end to any chance of him playing in the Premier League again.
Reina was a very good keeper, but I do agree he was overrated.
He was often called world class by Liverpool fans, and he certainly wasn’t that. His handling and goalkeeping of the near post left a lot to be desired.
He was a good shot stopper, good with his distribution, very quick off his line. He was also vocal and a good leader/organiser. He would suit our current team, or City better than Donnarumma.
Compared to Alisson though, he’s not even close.