I’m confused by PSG’s central midfield ever since the Motta-Verratti-Matuidi trio was over.
That trio made sense at least stylistically, even if on paper perhaps lacked a bit more individual quality (not the only reason of course) to make that extra step?
Fast forward a few years later; not enough sense stylistically, perhaps even less individual quality, but only more depth?
I see something similar at Spurs, for me it’s in midfield where the biggest difference/drop happened since Poch’s best side.
Not only the drops in quality of Dier and Alli, but they also never replaced Dembele. And for a while, that was their midfield triangle (with Eriksen playing inside right between the lines).
Moving the Agger talk to here from the VvD thread but surprised at the lack of appreciation for him. Tell you what Matip wouldn’t look so great next to Skrtel. In recent times Agger is right up there just behind VvD as amongst our best CBs and fought to stay here even when we were struggling to challenge for CL spots and City with their money and Barca at the top of the game at the time both wanted him.
At the time Barca were at the very top of the football pyramid and wanted Agger to be the Puyol replacement, 5 year mega-money contract would have meant he was guaranteed cash till 2018. That was a huge deal he could have had. Barca ended up with Vermaelen a year later instead think everyone but LFC lost in that situation. City, well… money! They ended up with Nastasic instead. Yet again think we were biggest beneficiaries involved.
Does this outcome in itself not demonstrate that their pursuit of Agger does not earmark him as an excellent defender. They were already in the situation of taking wild punts on defenders who were good on the ball and hoping it worked it out.
Agger was overrated to the extent that he had a decent shot on him a couple of times and expecting that he would do it several times a season.
Defensively he was pretty good. But it’s hard to compare and contrast when players have different styles. Carra was a good defender but because of very diffetent attributes to what makes Matip good or Hyypia good.
And it’s different to rank defenders because of different eras played in.
roughly you have different tiers (imo)
VVD
Matip
Hyppia
Carra
Henchoz
Agger
Konate*
Gomez*
Lovren
Sakho
Skrtel
I don’t think Agger is shit or equally anywhere near the standard of Van Dijk
Fair point but I wouldn’t say a back up choice not being great (although not terrible if it weren’t for injuries) doesn’t automatically mean the first choice target isn’t great. As it turns out Barca, even if you do accept the targets they went for on ability basis, were still making terrible choices long term due to the physical condition of both.
Worth a read on Agger. What he put himself through for us ended his career early and was so often playing with limitations due to injury issues. A fit and in form Agger would rival Matip to be Van Dijk’s partner in a “best in the Premier League” dream 11 for Liverpool.
As a Liverpool fan I truly believe we as a club are different. My view is that the players we sign should understand this and act accordingly and its the identification of players who buy into that which perpetuates the reality that it is a special, different club. Agger was one of those players and its why we should feel an extra fondness for him. But that doesn’t in itself make him a better player. Even if you fall back on the idea that he would have been better if not for the injuries, you cannot x out the injuries as they happened and so you can only judge him on what he actually did.
For me, he was an excellent defender who was on a par with the other top defenders in the league at the time. That is the bare minimum for being a liverpool player though so when thinking about how that ranks him in the clubs’ greats, it’s very mid table. We’re a club with multitudes of players who stood out above their peers, and done so in multiple generations.
I think Agger is below the greats of our glory days in the 70s and 80s etc. but in Premier League era I think he’s up there on ability with peak Hyypia and Matip just below VvD. Other good players like Carra just below it. Guys like Henchoz and Skrtel were well below those levels.
