That’s very clever. Personally, I think not taking up a position to block your own teammate’s free kick would have been sufficient, but your idea works too.
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That mindset won’t lead us anywhere productive. If you’re going to reject someone pointing out what you’ve done wrong because you perceive them or their performance as inferior, then you’re implicitly placing the perceived status of the other person over what they’re saying.
Which already means you’re not listening.
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Too clever by half. His position at that free kick was inexplicable. He was literally there by himself picking daisies with a complete lack of situational awareness. Wasn’t like it was blasted at him from 2 yards away.
Don’t agree. Klopp is also not exactly at the top of his coaching game right now but he has a job to do so he still has to point out the mistakes even if he is equally to be responsible for this season as much as the players. Hendo is not playing well, agreed but he has a job not just as a player but also a Captain. Would you rather a Captain who keeps quiet meekly when the going gets tough?
I’ve been captained by someone who patently didn’t belong in the 1st XI and who insisted on being a loud mouth to boot, when it reaches that point there will be resentment no matter much people bleat about leadership or team harmony. Not sure if you’ve ever played a team sport but how much of a loud mouth you are on the pitch is directly related to how useful you are on it as well.
The person you described is obviously not Henderson. He is a Captain accepted and respected by the squad and Klopp. I would be worried if he does not behave like it. He has build up a reputation for leadership that the squad accepts. So I am not sure your experience with that captain is anyway even remotely close to what the squad relationship with Hendo.
You think not? He’s not the player he used to be, not by far and if I’m honest, is living off that reputation rather than providing the leadership you speak off. If the world at large is basically united in the point that we’ve let the legs of our midfield go on our pitch then we certainly cannot think that paid professionals working with that group day in and day out aren’t also doubting their usefulness at the back of their heads, team harmony or not. If anything, it’s a contributing factor to the malaise that you can see within the team. So if you’re not concerned when you see someone not carrying their weight around but still throwing their weight around, literally, then you’re not seeing what’s right in front of you.
You can bury your head in the sand all you want but the lack of meritocracy that’s crept in is seeping that much lauded team spirit that we had and it no wonder the mentality that we used to have is long gone.
The elephant in the room being - who would u replace Henderson with?
This is the group that has to get us to the summer…
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You call us burying heads in the sand, and of course you are enlightenment of the world. When Hendo is no longer the Captain because he is no longer good enough, then so be it. Right now he is still the captain and needs to do what a Captain does. What you are suggesting is that only the best players have the right to speak, pretty much like the culture they built in clubs like PSG where certain players are untouchables and other players have to kowtow to them.
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I have to say, it’s not Henderson’s fault he’s being picked is it? So this “he can’t be shouting at someone because he’s rubbish now” is a bit of a nonsense.
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Hendo to take up the Milly role from the summer with an emphasis of bringing every ounce of his experience and encouragement to those doing battle on the pitch… Alisson to take the Vice Captains armband and leave VVD and Robbo to concentrate on their own 90mins each game
Not at all. He is no longer good enough, period. His playing time has been diminishing over the past few seasons and there has been long debate over his position as a starter in this team and we are much the poorer for continuing with him as being one. It’s not the best that have the right to speak as it is often not the best that bear the armband but on the whole in a team sport, it is at very least someone that is able to pull their weight that has it. Your argument seems to be to say that I’m saying to be a leader on the pitch one has to be the best on it which is not what I’m saying at all.
Oft times there is a distinction that there is a club captain who embodies what the leadership culture of the team is and someone on the pitch who is the go to. That is definitely a role that Henderson should be in and he has proven himself to be able to represent the Club in a manner worthy of praise. That is not translating itself on the pitch however and he’s finding it difficult to contribute while also then demanding of others and that is not just to his own detriment because he knows it and it surely affects his own game but also others around him who go, ‘but hang on a minute…’
Whiskeynose was a bastard and nobody can convince me he didn’t have a finger in the refereeing that went their way but by and large he knew when someone had outlived their part on the pitch. We had all the ingredients for a period of dominance after we won the league but one can’t help but feel we’ve squandered it over a misplaced loyalty as to what can be done in the pitch and at the end of the day, what’s on the pitch is what matters.
Bajcetic injury has fucked us up more than we knew at the time and that in itself is one 9f the more hard hitting indictments on our planning than anything. More so than anything, I think a change in formation would do best for us;
4-2-3-1,
Gomez to come in for Trent
Milner and then one of Henderson and Fabinho for the slot in the 2.
Gakpo/Jota/Firmino/Elliot/Salah to rotate in the 3 with some cameos to Diaz
Nunez up front
At the moment this group in it’s current shape and format isn’t getting us to summer at anything better than 8th. We’ve had January/February blues before and people will point out to how we snatched a CL spot after in 20/21 but we’d already turned the corner by March. We’re going to be in mid - April soon, this team and this mentality is way different to then.
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who decides the captainship then? You can say he is not good enough, that is your right. I say its the squad and Klopp who decides and until the day he is no longer Captain, he has to do what a Captain does because the only worse thing the players can do now after being so shit, is for them to to not even show any fire. Like what Alisson said yesterday on the supposed spat, it two person who want to fixed things, its 2 person who see something wrong and want to correct it so I don’t see where the ‘Henderson should just keep quiet, just because he, like many others, are playing shit’ He is the Captain for goodness sake. If our current Captain cannot even show some fire in this shitty season, then this team is really shittier than shit.
Quiet? You do realise that I put Henderson in my team in my post above as we’re here where we are now and cannot change it and as @Tesh said, we have to get through to the summer. He will get on the pitch before now and the end of the season and will hopefully contribute more than he has. With that in mind and bearing in mind his own performances I would suggest he be more circumspect with his berating at the very least.
The only saving grace in this train wreck of a season is that we’re nearing the end of it and with regards to some players in our first team, Henderson included, the same applies as well.
Did he need to have a go?
Or let them sort it?
in this shitty season, then this team is really shittier than shit.
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@gasband - Phrase of the week right there …! Collect your prize at the door :0)
let’s all have an understanding that the captain’s armband goes to the player on the pitch. If he’s not on the pitch, he’s not the captain.
Henderson can be a leader off the pitch even if he’s not playing every minute of every match.
But any leader worth his salt doesn’t need to turn red in the face to get his point across. I think he’s losing the respect of other players with such behavior and cracks are starting to show
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That’s the crux of the issue. Pointless. Alisson is the last player that needs a rocket up the arse.
It was him getting involved for the sake of it, not inspiring others to do better. Had he been giving it to Konate or Fabinho, no problem.
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I watch every game I can, support them and expect us to win every game, deluded I know but that is my philosophy.
Yes I do get critical of individual and team performances, but always hope that players prove me wrong and I want each and every signing to succeed
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