Nothing in that response is a refutation of the point. Yes we won games in April, but we limped badly through those first 4 wins looking well off our prior form. We then didnt win again.
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It refutes everything you said, starting with the claim of being poor in ânearly three full monthsâ.
Reality is, the poor form, in a substantive manner, was truly in the games vs N/Castle and PSG.
The games in May, after the league was won, were of zero consequence one way or the other.
This issue has been way overstatedâŚ
If someone says we did not play well against a team saying we won isnât a counter argument, it is a different conversation. You are at best arguing against the importance of the observation that our performances dropped off after February, but itâs also particularly amusing to use âwe got the results therefore it is wrong to say we were poorâ by presenting that run of results
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And if the roles where reversed, and Everton are going neck and neck with Man City for the title would you want a shit, mid table and bitter (cos its been years since weâve won anything whilst Everton have won loads) LFC to go and beat City to help Everton?
Iâm not talking about what their bitter and twisted fans want. Iâm talking about their highly paid âprofessionalâ footballers not trying.
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The hatred and bitterness is ingrained in the whole club, look at the way the players kick us off the pitch whenever they play each other
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But that is not the point here. You said we were poor for nearly 3 months, which I showed was a lie and overstated..
I identified it to be of far less duration, specifically wrt the timeline.
Speaking more broadly, there is not a championship winning team which did not have a dip during the season. Apoint recently made by no less a person than Guardiola about City.
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Winning doesnât mean you played well. We were discussing the subjective evaluation of the PERFORMANCES and the appearance of now familiar flaws in our play. Results are not relevant to that.
A lot of it was understandable and was largely written off and excused for those reasons. But those flaws that emerged in our game in that periodâŚthe lack of running, the inability to win duels, the lethargyâŚwe never got it back for more than 30 mins a month
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We were poor for more than three months - those April matches you cite can work as evidence for that.
The home win versus Everton was an improvement on the reverse fixture, which I would argue was in the beginning of the slide. A 2-2 draw where we dominated the ball yet were outshot, not a great match but the derby is often like that.
A loss away to a midtable Fulham side is not proof of much, but the manner of it was grim - late goal of a type we have become quite familiar with this season.
West Ham win was 3 points, but that West Ham side was mediocre at best. Only the absolute determination of the bottom 3 to go down kept them out of a relegation fight. We had absolutely battered them at their place in December, this match was not quite as tight as the score suggests, but it wasnât a great performance.
Leicester away was an unusual match, loads of shots, relatively few good ones. Fortunate to get a late winner against a side we brushed aside in December.
You can discard the May ones if you like, but we very much resumed that form in August. Much like the April matches, we were getting the points - there were posters crowing on here after 5 rounds and 15 points that we were going to walk the league, but the malaise was there to see.
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I never claimed winning meant you played well. I said you overstated our dip in form, which wasnât "nearly three months ".
And even when you properly interrogate the games following PSG loss, not all the performances were poor as you claim.
Again another overstated comment. As I showed already our dip in form was in the period following the Newcastle and PSG games
Not sure you showed much of anything but a form table - which absolutely does not say how a team is playing, just the results we are getting. One need only go back and read the match threads at the time to see there was a general feeling that we were not playing well - and indeed that we would have a very hard time against PSG.
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You responded to comments that we were not playing well from Feb on by disagreeing and presenting only the results (that werenât even good) to support your argument. It is the clear implication of your argument, such that you have made one
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No sir! I responded to your claim that we were poor for nearly three months.
That is a clear overstatementâŚ
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I showed a form table that clearly shows that we were not poor for nearly three months or six months as claimed hereâŚ
We won the first 5 games of this season, and we absolutely were poor for those too. You seem to be struggling with the idea that a side can win games and still play poorly. Slotâs side was absolutely dominant in most games into January, and then somehow things started to erode. I would say the only match that we genuinely played well from the beginning of February was the Spurs game, plus a superb half against Southampton (who were terrible). The City game is an outlier because the tactics meant City had to attack and we could just counter - and it was an excellent result. But for now over a year, our standard of play has largely been in decline. It took some time for results to catch up, but they absolutely did.
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Of those first 5 I think a lot is given more to the goals conceded.
Bournemouth we were excellent for about 60 mins
Newcastle was utterly dreadful against 10 men
Arsenal we played well and should have built from there.
Burnley was fine bar no one could score.
Everton was also decent till around 60.
Watch us now itâs far worse, so open a slow Casemiro strolls through. The only thing Sunday proved is that Man Utd side isnât that much better. As for in match threads. They are mostly overreactions itâs why so many of us avoid it.
There wasnât much wrong with Arsenal for 50 minutes in the tail end of last season eithier. Problem is we arenât even getting halfâs of decent football anymore. Slot at the beginning had a set up of get the goals, press and then slow down. Now we just do the slow down part.
Itâs not changing
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Sort of suggests that the conditioning program was the first element to result in fundamental changes. At the start of last season, there would have been a carry-over effect, and perhaps that was all but gone by January 2025.
I do think there is a certain arrogance or hubris to Slotâs style, to desire to utterly control the game as a first condition to winning the game. Very different from some of Kloppâs teams, especially the early ones, that seemed to be designed to create chaos and be better positioned to take advantage of it.
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If Aston Villa stays in fifth place + Crystal Palace qualifies for the Conference League + Manchester City wins the FA Cup
First place to the Champions League
Second place to the Champions League
Third place to the Champions League
Fourth place to the Champions League
Fifth place to the Champions League
Sixth place to the Champions League
Seventh place to the Europa League
Eighth place to the Europa League
Ninth place to the European Conference League
In addition to Crystal Palace, it would be possible to see 10 English clubs in the European competitions next season
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