The Middle East Thread

Corrected, you are welcome :innocent:

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The real problem is that it’s an ethno religious state.

I know a Jewish/ Israeli restaurant owner that sells traditional food. She has come out calling for peace publicly (not pro Palestine, just peace) and as a consequence she has been shunned by Jewish community. Half the world away, and in any other situation calling for peace would be seen as normal. Yet religion is so tied to Israel (or I should say exploited) it becomes one and same.

Even within the Jewish communities criticism of Israel is seen as an attack on religion. Which is wrong.

All the traditional customers have gone, ironically word has gotten out about this. Trade is now picking up (non Jewish community). However sad it’s so sad to see. That someone calling for peace is seen as an enemy.

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This is something that I don’t quite understand. I guess it’s the inherently tribal nature that we can’t seem to shake as a society.

When I say I want peace, I don’t want it to be just the Palestinians not being oppressed. I don’t want Israelis to be oppressed either. I just want people to coexist happily, and peacefully.

Such a waste of human potential.

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Further proof that people are fuckwits.

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A bit more lip service from the US. Who are they trying to fool, really?

I saw a report yesterday how a young 17 years old Gazean was extracted from Gaza in February and brought to Switzerland, where he has since been admitted as a refugee. The poor boy has lost a leg and is thus in a wheel-chair. His weight when coming into the country was 29 kg. Yes, 29 kg. I saw pictures from him as he is now, and it’s still frightening to see how skinny he is, even after months of treatment in hospital and being able to eat properly again.

We don’t see many pictures coming out from Gaza currently, but I’m sure that there are many other living skeletons walking around in Gaza as we speak. And then, you have these freaking hypocrites giving Israel another thirty days (!) to obstruct aid for these people. :see_no_evil:

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Those comments from him have my brain in a knot. Because he can’t separate his ethnicity from the state of Israel and their actions, we should instead limit the coverage?

That seems nuts. I do realise Israel is a very unique case because of the link between ethnicity and the reasons behind the creation of the state, but still.

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Nekminnit, warships and aircraft deployed in the region. Biden has proven to be weak as piss.

That assumes that Biden is primarily interested in peace. His main aim is to prevent the conflict from affecting oil output. The fact that, aside from Iran, the main Arab nations don’t give a shit about Palestinians or Lebanese people, doesn’t exactly help.

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And I assume that the Iranians only see them as a useful way of prodding Israel.

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To be honest, I actually wonder if there is someone left to care about the fate of the Palestinians… and you can add Lebanon to that, who cares about them?

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Syria , Lebanon and the land encompassing modern day Israel.

That area has always been fucked up (putting it plainly).

I don’t know where you take that from. Lebanon is the birthplace of a great antique civilization, called the Phenicians. At some point, they were dominating the entirety of the Mediterranean sea. Later, they came under Greek and Roman domination, but enjoyed a good bit of stability over many centuries.

During the Middle Ages, Western Europe came up with their crusades, and put some real suffering in that region, but they were soon ousted by the Arabs, who again brought an era of stability and prosperity. Later, the Ottomans exerted a long-lasting domination over the region, until the end of WW1, and a short occupation by the English Empire until WW2.

All this is of course over-simplified, but I wouldn’t call any of these eras ā€˜fucked up’. Of course, there must have been intermediary situations of instability and wars, as anywhere else. But to call the Middle East out as a perennial problematic region isn’t correct imo.

Of course, the current situation is as fucked as you want. Implanting a new religious state with totally foreign people amidst a settled area, with a settled religious belief: what could go wrong, eh?

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I’m inclined to give @Sithbare the benefit of the doubt and believe that he’s referring to the past century, for which there is plenty of evidence as to how and why the region is messed up.

That said, it’s not as though it’s been unique in that regard.

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Of course, that is not exactly a new tradition for the region either. Israel is only the latest state to do so in that territory.

I’m just saying that the region has been horribly mismanaged ever since the fall of the Ottoman Empire.

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And it’s not just the Israel equation.

Iraq since the gulf war.

Syria.

Radical Sunni terrorist outfits like ISIS , radical Shia terrorist outfits like Hezbollah , Saddam , the existing Sunni-Shia conflict.

Things have almost always escalated there with interventions of various countries.

None of which has happened without explicit external intervention, specifically the European colonial powers to begin with and then predominantly the US (ever since oil was discovered). It’s more than a bit myopic and dismissive to just blame the region and its inhabitants themselves.
This version of Iran is the result of longstanding US meddling, Israel was shunted in by multiple colonial powers, Saddam was directly supported by the US once they fucked up their chances in Iran. Any attempt at democracy in Egypt was regularly undermined by the US. The CIA created Al Qaeda to combat Russians in Afghanistan. Western powers also had a hand in the creation of ISIS.

https://msuweb.montclair.edu/~furrg/pol/wtc/oblnus091401.html

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Not to mention the funding of Pakistan as well.

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Going back nearly 100 years prior to the British-US led Iranian coup, Persia was described as a chessboard on which the world powers play a game for global domination. It is a part of the world that is squashed between great imperialist powers and experienced frequent destabilizing effects of their conflicts, even before the impacts of oil exploitation became an issue.

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Sinwar reported killed. Maybe they can stop the extermination now.