This is true, but across a lot of other fan opinion the perceived injustices are a bit thin.
Villa fans think they should have had three penalties on Saturday. That’s fucking absurd. I don’t it’s similarly absurd to call out the early challenge in the box on Nunez, and Coote viewing a lad jumping on Salah’s back while through on goal as ‘play on lads’.
I don’t think Arsenal fans have a leg to stand on with their complaints about their red cards, and I’ve seen them moaning that they should have had a winner against us despite there being three offences in the run up.
I think you have to stand back and look at this objectively. I think a lot of what you see Liverpool fans claiming on social media is twaddle, but there continue to be serious incidents surrounding our club and certain referees that go beyond tribalism. I’m thinking of Doku kicking Mac Allister in the chest. The Odegaard handball. Any number of red card challenges, handballs, and no pens. I’m certain that no club can claim to have had a legitimate goal ruled out because the VAR lad got themselves in a muddle.
I’ll say again. You don’t have to believe this is a vast spiderweb conspiracy. You just have to note that a lot of people in this country don’t like Liverpool. That proportion is particularly high in Greater Manchester. Greater Manchester is particularly over represented amongst referees. There you go.
This isn’t targeted at any particular club or official, more a general blanket statement, but I wonder how much of the supposed bias would be remedied if players and managers weren’t constantly screaming abuse at match officials and blaming them publicly when things don’t go their way.
If someone had a go at me in my workplace, I’d absolutely think they were an arsehole from that point on.
Isn’t that a little chicken and egg though? If they weren’t so shite at their jobs then I think there would be a lot less abuse (apart from the usual whiners).
But if everyone had a go at you then you might still hate your job but it would difficult to find reason to favour any one of the cunts over the other.
I see Coote’s old man is a former professional cricketer who played 1 (ONE) first class match for Nottinghamshire.
The other guy in the video is allegedly Ben Kitt who is a former professional cricketer who played 2 (TWO) first class matches for Nottinghamshire.
It would appear David Coote Jnr is surrounded by people who were absolutely fucking shite at their jobs…
That presupposes that all the incidents were equal. I love Jurgen, but I doubt there’s an EPL match official going who would take a similar view. I think he’s definitely at the extreme end of ‘having a go’ from the sidelines.
If this had come out and he had no history of fucking us over and 99% of our fanbase didn’t already think he was as bent as a dog’s back leg then maybe we could give him some benefit of the doubt. We might think “Fucking hell, that’s a disgraceful thing to say, this bloke needs a break from the game and some educating, but at least he’s always been beyond reproach when reffing our games”.
As it is he’s proved himself to be a fucking corrupt, cheating prick time and time again.
Do you watch all football games in general though, or mostly just ours? If it’s the latter it might just be the availability heuristic speaking. I don’t really think many managers are that subdued in games, hence why that infamous Guardiola GIF.
I mean even in purely Liverpool terms you only need to compare Klopp to, say, Rafa. It’s clear that no two manager’s conduct during games is the same and I don’t even think it’s a contentious statement to say Jurgen lets the heat of the moment to get to him - he himself has said as much and that he often gets ashamed afterwards watching back how he’s behaved during a game.
I loved his passion and as a fan I wouldn’t change that about him, but I could easily see how it would have an effect on officials over the course of nearly a decade.
Just my opinion, and I don’t watch many (if any) games that don’t involve us, but while he might be more aggressive than average perhaps, I don’t think he’s “at the extreme end”. I think he’s solidly upper midtable on that, maybe a top 4 contender. Off the top of my head I can think of at least Arteta, Guardiola, Mourinho, Santo, Tuchel, as similar.
I would love a detailed statistical analysis of refereeing errors (if you could even compile such a thing), to see what the ground truth is, and whether you could replicate these effects over the course of seasons/referees.
My suspicion is that the dataset would be interesting. I really don’t know if any club gets “dicked over” more so than others, but based on the little I’ve seen so far, we definitely don’t fare well, whereas City seem to fare suspiciously well.
We already know that bias exists – just look at the treatment England’s finest Sir Harry gets, as opposed to how Salah literally carries the entire league ('s right backs) on his shoulders. The more pertinent question is, is it systemic/endemic? Or does it really “even out”?
I don’t think there’s any one cause or smoking gun, and fault on both sides honestly as I’ve said - but I suspect that a culture of mutual respect on the pitch and a system of greater transparency and accountability on the side of the officials and governing body would go a long way towards establishing overall fairness.
What we have now is a self-perpetuating cycle of abuse, frustration, them-and-us thinking and silence, defensiveness and inscrutability on the officials’ side, which can’t be allowed to continue ad infinitum.
I’m aware of what Tomkins did before, but from what I remember of it, it’s not a statistical analysis, just a list of data, and to me back then it was rather cherry-picked even though whatever story it did tell was somewhat compelling.
Tompkins has done this.
On here, and previously @jaffod has poited out unexplainable decisions that have cost Liverpool.
The usual argument about “it happens other clubs” doesn’t wash in this instance.
On the non foul on Salah last Saturday, can anyone explain how that decision isn’t biased or cheating?
The Doku assault on MacAllister? Biaseed, cheating or inept.
Hardly inept after watching from half a dozen angles.
These are major moments in a season
And they don’t even out.
Klopp was an interesting one as I think initially his rage was viewed mostly as part of the overall charming personality that meant it typically also came with a quick and sincere apology where people would generally laugh at the whole thing. But we as a society love nothing more than turning on someone who was once well liked and so it was inevitable the tide would shift. But it’s also notable there were a couple of officials where Klopp’s dislike of them was far more measured. It had none of the fun elements about it, especially as those didn’t come with the self effacing apologies, and so somehow even though these were more justified made people react negatively to them. Once that dynamic kicked in we quickly slid to being a club where one of our players could be elbowed in the face by an official and be seen as the party who needed to apologize for it.
But that is Klopp specific. I think even during the period of rosy views of him, we still got fucked repeatedly by refs wanting to prove to themselves and everyone else that they wouldnt swayed by the Anfield atmosphere. And would not give Mo free kicks because you know those people like a bit of a dive. And…