Pretty much any WC (before this one) that the All Blacks didn’t win was considered a failure. This is probably the first time they don’t go in as favourites.
This sounds pretty seismic 
Question?
Do Ireland restrict their players from playing in France?
Ireland doesn’t pick players who are not playing for one of the four provinces.
Fair enough, did wonder.
Llanelli have pulled out of the Welsh Premiership for next season because they will be unable to field teams to meet all of their fixture demands.
They are basically going to play friendlies.
Wow! That is seismic. I knew some of the regions were in desperate shape, but dropping out of that tier is a crisis in and of itself.
Yeah, it has a bit of a cliff edge feeling to it somehow but when you look at their fixture list combined with the demands of feeding the Scarlets it looks like something has broken.
I’ve always maintained that the game in Wales needs a massive restructuring project but I’ve honestly no idea what the final lay out would be.
Finance and ring fencing that finance needs to happen but also how the league feeds players upwards. Mess.
Llanelli should be the side of the whole of west wales for everyone west of Pont Abraham. For whatever reason it doesnt work that way as the pipeline from local rugby to them just does not exist.
Yeah, I can believe it. From the Scarlets angle they cover north Wales but you have a half baked route for 30 or so players to RGC then it’s ?? Everything else feels ignored.
Wasn’t Cardiff’s area massively expanded at Llanelli’s expense?
Im not even talking about the catchment area of the Scarlets, but more the lack of reach of Llanelli as the main feeder club to the regional side. There are problems galore with welsh rugby, but Llanelli are not like someone like Bridgend, where any player local to them could just easily play for Neath or Cardiff. They have a big geographic area all to themselves and do nothing to cultivate it. There will be lots of very good players in Pembrokeshire and Ceredigion acting with shock to them saying they cannot field a team having never made any effort to bring young players from those areas into their fold.
I have some sympathy for Llanelli. Rugby in Wales is full of mercenaries. You’ve got clubs propped up by benefactors paying players way over the odds to allow them to move up leagues. If that money dries up the club sinks like a stone. Llanelli would have to pay a lot of players to have a squad able to compete in all competitions.
When I was playing Oakdale found a heap of cash somehow and pilfered players from Pontypwl. They jumped 5 leagues in 5 seasons. Oakdale as a place is tiny. They’ve dropped off a bit since. Merthyr was another one.
Heading to Leinster v Ulster tomorrow. 51,700 sell out. Sad to see what’s happening in the Welsh game. Shame Wales and Scotland can’t have similar model to Irish provinces
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Fantastic to hear it’s booming. Enjoy!
I’m honestly finding it difficult to fully understand how it works so well in Ireland but is failing so badly in Wales. There’s problems in governance, club finance and the like but basic support for going to see games is woeful. There’s just no interest.
Regional rugby in Wales was always going to be controversial but you’d have hoped that the tribal issues that stunted support for it originally would have passed by now. It clearly hasn’t.
I think Wales made a mistake in trying to create their regions out of the power clubs. It might look the same as Ireland did, but they already had a recognized provincial structure in place that made those 4 regions the obvious approach. Wales had to create theirs from scratch and in doing so I think they made mistakes.
There were definitely too many, but even now at 4 I think it would benefit from being reduced further to 3. But I think the biggest thing is the way they tried to maintain the presence of the major clubs at that organizational level. All it did was give rise to years of internecine fighting over who has prominence, and distracted those primary clubs from the club level competition that has to remain strong for the pipeline to be maintained.
I think the best thing Rugby in Wales can do is to disband the regions and have those primary clubs return to being truly amateur (not enforced, but not responsible for financing the paying of the best players in the country). The WRU should then set up an regional organizational structure under their control that is responsible for running the regional sides, which then becomes the way to distribute the central contracts with the WRU. The regional aspect is tough with so much of the demographic being so tightly packed, but you could do something like a mid wales region based out of Aberystwyth, a West Wales region based out of Llanelli (or even Swansea) and a South Wales region based out of Cardiff. The clubs would then be responsible for just looking after themselves. You’d still have to figure out the relationship between the clubs and regions, but there is any number of ways you can arrange that if the overall structure is coming from the WRU who is centrally funding it
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I agree they made mistakes, several in fact. I also agree that the regions should have been completely separated from the clubs below them.
It’s the funding I struggle with. Currently there are benefactors propping up the regions financially. Can the WRU manage to go on their own?
Secondly, finance at club level is a crap shoot. I touched on it above. With so many clubs so close together players basically follow the money. It leads to instability as the money rises and falls within clubs depending on how they’re funded i.e. sponsors and benefactors come and go. That area needs massive regulation. Also, money that gets filtered down from the WRU needs to be ring fenced towards youth and coaching development, not funding first team squads as it has done.
What all of that looks like in the end I’ve no idea.
Rather harsh. NZ have dominated rugby for so long. Focusing purely on world cups is a bit selective. There’s no such thing as a friendly in rugby. Every test matters.
Tri-Nations/Rugby Championship:
1996 NZ
1997 NZ
1998 South Africa
1999 NZ
2000 Australia
2001 Australia
2002 NZ
2003 NZ
2004 South Africa
2005 NZ
2006 NZ
2007 NZ
2008 NZ
2009 South Africa
2010 NZ
2011 Australia
2012 NZ
2013 NZ
2014 NZ
2015 Australia
2016 NZ
2017 NZ
2018 NZ
2019 South Africa
2020 NZ
2021 NZ
2022 NZ
NZ would have won the 2011 and 2015 titles as well if the normal/full schedule was played. Schedules were shortened due to the world cup that year. NZ have held the Bledisloe Cup for 20 straight years.
As for the world cup, while NZ certainly should have won more, we’ve been unlucky to say the least.
1987: NZ had the best team and won.
1995: NZ were poisoned before the final. Players throwing up on the pitch during the game. Nowhere near match fit or ready. Lost in extra time.
1999: NZ had the best team. Unbelievable how we lost to France.
2003: NZ had the best team. Did not perform on the night against Australia. Gave Australia an easy intercept try. Destroyed Australia earlier in the year in Sydney putting up 50 points. Also put up 50 points against South Africa in Pretoria.
2007: NZ had the best team. Disgraceful refereeing cost us the game. France were awarded a try which was clearly forward. Without watching the game again, believe we had next to no penalties in the second half. McAlister sin binned which was very harsh. NZ much the better team.
2011: NZ had the best team and won.
2015: NZ had the best team and won.
2019: NZ had the best team. Did not perform against England.
NZ have also dominated the world rankings.
Outside all this, NZ have regularly lost top players overseas. Basically down to money and the bigger broadcast deals and sponsorship overseas.
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Precisely, that was the point - they have dominated world rugby to a level not reflected by only 2 world cup wins since 87. I didnt make a value judgement about what that says about them, so reject it was a “harsh” statement. I merely pointed out that the world cup frequently has punished even the best sides for having an off day at the business end of the tournment.
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Outside my post above and somewhat separate, rugby referees can have such a big effect on a game.
Unduly sometimes. Not exclusive to rugby as a sport, but certainly can and does play a part.