UK Politics Thread (Part 2)

Boris “Hold my champagne glass”

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That isn’t true.

The trouble is that just being accurate about the current government - just talking honestly about their actual transgressions - looks like feverish hyperbole. That’s how bad it’s got.

I’ve often found myself self-editing my comments about them, just because what I’m writing feels over the top, before realising it isn’t. It’s just stuff they have actually done and the way they actually behave.

The scale and the tempo of their scandals is dizzying. You can’t keep up, and it becomes hard to remember three or four scandals ago. There is literally something every other day. We’re all boiled frogs, thinking this kind of political dysfunction is somehow normal, because we’ve been increasingly exposed to it for a decade, to the point where the latest scandal doesn’t even seem to matter anymore.

And here we are, surely, surely at the rag end of Johnson’s sorry political career. The worst Prime Minister we have ever had. Politics and public life in the gutter. So many scandals it’s impossible to even list them. Outside a threat of Nazi invasion, 200 odd years of democracy never more under threat. And there are still people, wondering if the Labour leader would be any better, or accusing people like me of tribalism.

Fuck. Me.

On tribalism, I’m used to that accusation. But the reality is I heavily criticised Blair for a variety of things, most notably the invasion of Iraq. I left the party, which I’d joined as a youth member and didn’t vote for Labour in two successive election while Blair was leader. I only started voting Labour again when Blair had gone, and I didn’t rejoin until Corbyn.

I think we tend to over complicate politics. I still return to the basic tenet that if you believe society is best when we look after our most vulnerable, provide social safety nets, control essential services through the state, and seek social justice, then you are left and should vote Labour (and Labour should provide that platform). If you believe that society works best when we all pursue our own self-interest, when we prioritise private enterprise over social justice, and we allow the private sector to control as much as possible, then you are right wing and should vote Conservative (and they should provide that platform).

If you vote for the right wing agenda, I think you are wrong. But I can respect that you believe that it is genuinely in everyone’s best interest to organise things in that way.

But this Government doesn’t not believe in any of those things. It is single mindedly pursuing an agenda of elitism, concentrating as much wealth and opportunity in to a handful of people as it can, and actively undermining democracy, the law, process, and standards to do so. It isn’t just a difference of opinion, it’s a reaction to a government that is a clear and present danger to our country.

So please don’t think my vitriolic opposition and criticism to this government is ‘tribal’.

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Why?

Arh apologies , and I remember you slating Blair on TIA many times especially about Iraq, so again apologies, but it does come across sometimes that there is tribalism and sometimes the wonder is from personal perspective that yes I agree with 95% with what’s being said, but many of us know you are a labour party member and I’m not having a go at that, but sometime it is hard to tell if it’s genuine personal anger, or the fact of being a supporter of said opposition party.

All of which is genuinely fine and great in the grand scheme of things, but for someone like me who can see the shit show that is currently on offer , and the deep suspicion of all politicians being nothing more than a bunch of lying parasites then it sometimes become cloudy when it’s being suggested things would be different if so and so was in power, again I can’t blame people hating the current regime, but just wondered if a lot of the debate comes from just because of the party they represent.

Furlough payments, raising the personal allowance beyond what even Labour were demanding, increased investment in the NHS, increased investment in social care, expanding the eligibility for free school meals, online harms bill, upskirting bill, disability discrimination act, unprecedented increased in the minimum wage, fuel support payments…

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That’s your own fault. You’d rather tar them all with the same brush than acknowledge that the ones who tend to be the lying parasites all share common values of commitment to self over others, and impunity for themselves but not for others.

Tribalism is a sorry excuse especially if you’re defending a government unprecedented in its lack of morals and ethical standards.

Have you fact checked any of this where I defend this government ?

You quote many things that are prevalent in many other countries that are often seen as benchmarks for comparison for the UK’s government, such as furlough payments (compare with France, Germany, Ireland for example), or the online harms bill.

Are you also really going to quote expanded eligibility for free school meals after they attempted to take it all away and only reversed themselves under sustained public pressure (see also social care investment)?

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There is no way on Earth you can possibly argue the Tories are increasing their investment in the NHS. Giving money with one hand while selling it off the private sector with the other, in not investment. I mean I’m sure you can produce some sort of graph that shows investment has increased, but that not really the issue.

The Tories are very good and manipulating data. The claim they are building thirty new hospitals is a good example of this.

Seriously? They were U turned into this because they were shamed by a footballer!

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To be clear, I’m not claiming that you’re defending them directly.

You’re indirectly defending them by muddying the waters and claiming that all alternatives are the same anyway.

Yes because the Conservative Party have been so great at defending the economic interests of the working class.

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I’m no fan of Starmer. I don’t know what he stands for and can’t see him ever having the balls to bring about societal change that is desperately needed.
But…
To say he’d be no better that BJ or any of his cabinet is just ridiculous. They are evil, sociopathic, completely devoid of empathy or compassion. I’ll take boring and safe over that.

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The real tribalism is the people in the Conservative and Republican parties who turn a blind eye as their parties lurch more and more towards extremism.

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You cannot be serious. These are falling apart as the Tories have always wanted. For the first time ever I’m considering going against all my morals and getting private healthcare for my family. It’s literally impossible to get a GP appt here and a 5 year+ waiting list for any consultant

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Except it’s not, and barely outstrips inflation. Arguably the largest increase in a minimum wage ever was when it was introduced by a Labour government, giving 1.2 million adults an average pay rise of 10%. Between June 2000 and October 2001, it increased by £0.50 per hour from £3.60 per hour to £4.10 per hour, which is 13.9% in the span of 14 months.

Apart from the austerity Tories, the minimum wage has mostly increased 10% every two years, which if I recall correctly, outstrips inflation for the most part. Numbers from National Minimum Wage: previous rates | nibusinessinfo.co.uk

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Hey, be careful, they’re going to start blaming Labour Party members like you for making them vote Tory because you insulted them.

I’ve been waiting 7 months for an appointment to be sent to see a consultant in relation to my eyesight. My step mother was told she needed to be seen in may 2019 - that was in march 2019 … she was sent an appointment 2 years later in may 2021!
so yeah the NHS is on its arse.

No

Thatcher was the worst by a country mile

You are welcome

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Aqua fucking ducts.

tony blair must be pretty close!

Not even close.

A saint compared to that evil bitch

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