I guess the other way of looking at it is that in the lead-up to 97 we also didn’t have 5 years of government sleaze and scandal, a 40 day PM that destroyed the economy in 15 minutes, and a cost of living crisis that the ruling party has put out all the stops to ensure that we can’t fight out of. These are unprecedented times.
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If United beat us to the league title by 3 points, I’d be laughing at them for it only being 3 points given we really weren’t that good in that season.
Optimism……
In fairness, we did by the standards of the time.
Yes, Major’s government was known for its sleaziness, although they were amateurs compared to this lot.
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This is the concern. People liked Blair at the time. There doesn’t seem to be many that actually like Starmer, or a groundswell of love like some (rightly or wrongly) had for Corbyn. For Kier it seems to be a begrudging acceptance that we need to do anything to get the Tories out
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I know they are more middle ground but since the Alliance party,s roots are based in unionism,if they were to achieve a higher vote count than the other unionists parties,how come they then can’t be deemed as the other side of the community.
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This is what I was thinking. Surely the opposite of republicanism is supporting the status quo? Excluding them from the equation does appear to be ingraining sectarianism.
Alliance definitely wouldn’t consider themselves a Unionist party and have many candidates from nationalist backgrounds. The extreme unionist parties love to portray Alliance as nationalist.
Alliance may have more middle class unionists voting for them, but that’s probably to do with total disillusionment with unionist parties outside of their core base (which remains significant)
I know they don’t see themselves in that way,they are the middleground party,but they were formed by unionists.Are they keeping themselves out by not saying they are a unionist party,albeit a moderate unionist party?Would it affect their vote if they were to do that?
Definitely. They are neutral on the border issue and designated as ‘other’ rather than unionist/nationalist. This is the main reason why people like myself have voted for them. Focus on daily issues that matter rather than division and flags.
They have annoyed me recently though and thinking of going Green, though there’s always the ‘wasted vote’ dilemma with them
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I’ve voted Green at every election, general and local, since 1997 and let me tell you that it is never a wasted vote.
The more votes go to the Greens, the more media attention there is and, consequently, the mainstream parties have to start looking at green policies, although getting them to actually enact these policies is, of course, an entirely different matter.
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Here’s me thinking you were a cynical old git
Yes , but in local elections people tend to give the governing party a good kicking regardless. I still don’t see how an 8% swing here will translate to a 12% swing in a GE unless the Tories do something even more catastrophic to their reputation between now and then. And considering what’s gone before , it’s really stretching it to imagine just what that might be.
You appreciate the irony of putting a cross on a piece of paper for the green party?
Would be more appropriate to put a bean in a recycled jar though.
Sorry in advance for the rambling 
Well so far Conservatives seem to have lost about a third of the councillors that have been counted for, so we could say that they have had a kicking. If that pattern continues amongst the remaining election results the takeaway will probably be that the kicking has been delivered by a wider spread of parties than any one party.
As to the local vs national swing a few reasons pop into my head. The first is that not all councils are voting this week - so the % change in votes will reflect only those areas that have voted - that is probably going to distort the picture somewhat one way or another. Some of the big areas Labour (and Lib Dems) could pick up support such as London are not being fought this week. Likewise, labour voters in safe seats may feel less inclined to vote this time round dragging down labour’s share of the vote while usually a drop in voters may be at the governing party’s expense.
Recent by election wins have seen large swings because rival parties have acted together to get the best placed challenger to win - that is clearly not a strategy being used this week but could very well happen next year - it would be in Labour’s interest to see Lib Dems pick up Conservative seats that they have no chance of winning themselves.
People’s voting choices in local elections do not always reflect how they will vote nationally - Greens are picking up a lot of votes this time round which may reflect anti-Starmer sentiment - if so, are they going to hold onto those when there is a chance to change national government or will that move back to voting Labour or even Lib Dem)?
With all the news surrounding the SNP this year and its leadership changes, there is a strong risk they drop seats at the next election. Labour will most likely be favourites to pick these up if that does indeed happen. That isn’t going to be reflected in these elections.
National polling has Labour ahead by around 17 points. Any closing has been where don’t knows have moved back to Conservative. Those indicating a switch to Labour (or Lib Dem) from Conservative have not shown any indication of moving back. So, the 8% swing you are seeing may be not be representative of what may happen in a national vote.
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To everybody who’s posted similar to “we need to do anything and everything to get the Conservatives out” Why don’t Labour and Lib Dem stand on a joint stance of reversing BREXIT? That would certainly kick the blues out.
A big 
to your new avatar. Where can one go for coronation news on this site? It seems hopelessly devoid. Are we having a Charles III Coronation thread soon? Stateside, we love that kind of thing.
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Well I could rumble something up……
Please don’t. It will be just another thread for yourself and you know who to lock horns again…
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