same book dictates that adultery is punishable by stoning…
It varies tremendously across sports, but even the most stringent use a testosterone blood count test - which is really not capturing the whole problem. Male muscle mass after puberty is dramatically higher than women’s, just as one example. However, even those tests are at an elite level. Community sports tend to have a more binary (excuse the pun) all in or all out, simply because of the procedural expense, so in some sports self-identification is all that is required.
So for example qualifying for the Boston Marathon, you really can say you’re a woman and you’re allowed to race against women. That was the policy for rugby until quite recently.
Does it say anything about getting stoned before committing adultery?
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two words: Fallon Fox.
https://www.tiktok.com/@rikie/video/7219677293680020779?lang=en
You don’t know what you are talking about here, sorry.
I don’t want to be ad hominem, but the small amount of knowledge of religion, and the Bible, coupled with the brash and forthright approach, comes across to me like your scientific observations on sex and gender might do to other members of the forum.
When you talk about religion it reads to me like boys have a cock, girls have a vagina, or whatever the insight was that you were offering earlier.
I don’t want to hijack this thread as there is a religion thread. But what you say should not go without challenge.
Just before this post you quoted a verse from Leviticus, which was written within the context of a historic covenant that ended two thousand years ago. It was not written to, or for, people today. It is not authoritative for any Christian and has been superseded by the teachings of Jesus.
Whether or not you believe in any of that is beside the point.
Obviously you can point to loony’s like Westboro, but they are a hate-filled sect, and hardly representative. That’s as intellectually honest as saying Muslims are terrorists. It’s a shit show to go there, as it just isn’t true.
The core message of Jesus was to love one another. That is applicable to this thread, and I dare say if more people tried to do that, we would be in a much better place.
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I find myself sympathising with you both on this one @Klopptimist and @RedOverTheWater
The problem is that the Bible is a book that enables the Westboro mob to justify their awful shit. And it makes criticism of them entirely justifiable as well. It’s just that kind of book.
But we have a thread for this stuff, so let’s use that instead.
You mean quoting the bible? Sorry for the direct quote. Take it to the religion thread. I know exactly what I’m talking about thanks very much.
something to be aware of…
Not necessarily, and this misunderstanding, both about the outcomes for transitioning and how quickly in the medicalization of the transition it comes, is a large part of the misplaced hostility around the debate/
Transitioning takes on many many forms, with many different end points. But even in those who go as far as is medically possible with surgery, there is often several steps before the cross hormone therapy and it not uncommonly doesn’t go any further than that.
For sports, the rules are all over the place, especially for kids and adolescents, but once that are focused on adults and allow trans women to compete generally require a delay after initiation of the hormone treatment (commonly 1 year) as a baseline, often with other considerations placed on top of that. So the hypotheticals about a world ranked male just making a switch to compete against the women is a thought experiment that just doesn’t reflect how this actually happens where it is still allowed to happen.
Now that’s a discussion that I think REALLY needs to be put on the back burner.
I once had a transwoman initiate legal action against me for perceived discrimination, because my group disqualified her from a research study we were running. We did not DQ her because she was trans, but due to some clinical complications associated with it. It is a real difference, but I can see why that is what she heard. While it was a massive ball ache for me, what was really happening was a woman dealing with a LOT of shit experiencing what she felt was just one more form of exclusion and rejection and so responded to my team’s actions in the context of that. This is why the sports question is not trivial.
In one sense, with everything else likely going on in the life of a young trans person, playing in sports seems trivial. But when you listen to the kids who want to just be part of a team there is tremendous value in it. Banning them from sports is not a decision that comes without significant negative consequences of it own.
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my son, 8 years old. has been playing team sports since he was 5. so, he’s currently on his 3rd season of baseball (and soccer, hard to even call it footy at the age of pack-ball). His teams, combined… have won FOUR games in those three years. So I asked him about how he feels when they lose, and he simply replied that he likes his team and that’s all that matters.
He is an only child and doesn’t have a lot of kids in our neighborhood his age, so it’s just as much about socializing at his age… He likes it.
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You mean medical transitioning of kids? If so, actual medical practice is actually largely in line with what opponents of juvenile transitioning oppose. The outrage over the treatment kids are being put through is an almost entirely made up issue.
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The issue with that is it appears to be bullshit. Fox knocked her out but never fractured her opponants skull.
I’m leaving this here and not discussing it.
There is some pretty shocking stuff extending from the Cass Review of the Tavistock fiasco, including the (non-medically qualified) staff of an external advocacy organization being able to make referrals to the Tavistock against the advice of GP’s.
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So what they’re “suggesting” is, a girl can legally have a dick sewn on at 15 but has to wait a year to legally stick it anywhere?
Madness
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These critiques need to be read VERY VERY carefully and understood in the full context of the debate, because they are often just as ideological as the individuals they are criticizing. Critically, in this specific example referral to Tavistock is not the same as someone receiving the treatments that are being complained about. The clinicians at Tavistock still have medical agency and won’t be giving kids scary treatments just because they’ve showed up for an appointment. Treating advocates helping kids gets seen by experts who are going to take them seriously as a scandal is a big give away that the line for these people is that medical care for trans people should not exist.
In terms of the treatments given, What you also see in these critiques is lumping in puberty blockers (Tx with decades of use in cis kids, with effects on sexual development that are entirely reversible upon cessation) with cross hormone therapy and surgery. This is at best a misunderstanding, but more often is itself a reflection of an ideological framing that makes its treatment of the issue dubious and is often done with the intention to sensationalize and scandalize.
Without puberty blockers started at the right time, medical transitioning becomes a lot more difficult, more traumatic, and with a lot less satisfactory outcomes. They are therefore given when they are to stop the clock for the patient. To allow them to proceed with the psychological therapy that is indicated before more permanent medical Tx is initiated, to experiment with the social transitioning that is indicated as the first line for teens and preteens. If people were serious about wanting medical treatment of trans teens to be taken soberly they would be in support of the use of puberty blockers. Instead, what is experienced with teen trans patients is their medical providers not listening them, often over the course of months and years, and forcing them to get closer and closer to the point that use of puberty blockers has a limited effect. This is why these advocate groups exist, because they have to because the kids are too often not being treated seriously.
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To understand what this means you have to understand what medical guidance is and why it exists. Guidance of this sort is more effectively thought of a range of medically defensible responses than as a set of directions. What this update reflects is the recognition of the difficult situation Drs are put in when finding a rare patient where earlier medical intervention is deemed appropriate. It is not a starting gun for Drs to start pushing kids to irreversible treatments at a younger age.
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Yeah, that’s why I said that they might have felt differently if sports were their thing.
It’s like saying that Trans people are not allowed to play the piano anymore. Lots would say “fuck it - I’m not arsed about music” and some would say “but playing the piano is my life!”