The playing population is more directly relevant. NZ in that sense is not that much of an over-performer. I did a regression model on the 2022 rankings, using registered players as the predicting independent variable. By that measure, NZ (2nd, 5th most players) was only 3 spots above direct ranking, England (3/3) was exactly where you would expect them. Scotland (8/15) was actually the best performer.
Excluding nations that have never made the WC, the US was the worst performer (16/7)
Primary sport, with leftovers for cricket, and leftover of leftovers for football. Canada ice hockey (38m) vs USA (330m) vs Russia (143m). So playing population definitely the most relevant imo.
Ah, let’s not go overboard 
My experience of Irish rugby from my playing days, which is admittedly a limited view and nearly 30 years old, was that it was similar to England - a sportfor the posh kids. I take it that wouldnt be the perspective anymore?
It still is within schools, in Ulster anyway. Private/grammar schools play rugby. Others play football. Ulster games are a good night out but very middle class. Clubs seem to be doing a a better job at diversifying the sport, and as I said in previous post it seems to becoming more popular and widely watched.
Still, the majority of Ireland’s players have come through expensive private schools within a 3km radius in Dublin
I dont know if St Mary’s College Dublin is fully private (my understanding is a lot of the catholic schools get some state funding), but my county played them a couple of times and we were struck that even as just a school they had more Irish internationals than we, as a county, has Welsh ones.
College rugby is definitely a thing. Same in New Zealand and South Africa.
I suspect it’s because that’s where the best infrastructure exists to develop the talent. Your small town club is likely not to have that and that includes the funding to allow it to happen. The colleges are offering more than just the rugby obviously.
I’ve remember it being a similar thing with football when I was at Uni but on a shit end of the scale. Even at that level the set up was just better to develop players.
A couple of the Dublin schools also have billionaire benefactors who pay a fortune for the top coaches, technology and facilities etc
Some of the prestigious private schools used to “recruit”. Grey College, Bishops
I am sure I have shared this story before, but my rugby playing days were the in the 90s, the period up to and including the game becoming openly professional. That was a similar scary period for Welsh rugby then about how we were going to afford it and keep up, but one of the perspectives that developed then was that UWIC, one of the colleges (uni?) in Cardiff could be used as a development step for our fledgling professional game. Prior to that they were known for having a good side with “some” youth internationals. By the mid 90s, if you were anywhere near the Welsh Youth set up they were actively recruiting you, with messages being sent that if you wanted to continue being considered for the youth set up, this was where you needed to be. This was the entry point into the new pro contracts the top level clubs would be offering out. It made sense. They had decent facilities and it created a concentration of talent that would theoretically elevate everyone involved.
The outcome was terrible. What it did was create a fake bar for success for kids who were not mature enough to deal with it and werent in a professional enough environment for the shimmer of professionalism they were presented with. What we saw was the best young players in the country all become standards students playing on the same club team with the culture of any university team, rather than a stepping stone to professionalism.We went through a period where there was a massive drop off in success form the U18s to U19…one age group went from winning a tour to NZ to coming bottom of the 5N…and more or less lost an entire generation of the country’s best youth players
Fascinating. I was playing at that time too. I remember Swansea Uni also being a good university side, playing other well established universities including Loughborough maybe? Bit foggy on that one.
Then I also remember some students playing in the same club I was at in Cardiff at the time.
Your post kind of makes me think focussing on the Universities, Swansea, Cardiff x2, Aberystwyth and possibly even Bangor and whatever is in Wrexham may bear fruit? Ponti too of course. But I currently think the regions are relied upon along with RGC in the north. I’m not convinced it’s working. So many players still not in the system or with a potential pathway up the ladder.
I thought they already did, I worked at Swansea University for 5 years in the mid part of the last decade and the focus was very much on talented rugby lads by certain areas of the University.
Including a cretin who smashed up a bar was given off with a slap on the wrists.
Honestly I don’t know, I’m just concerned about the state of Welsh rugby and the routes for capturing and developing young players. But if you had a guy smash up a bar it sounds that not much has changed from the situation @Limiescouse described above.
There’s lots in Welsh rugby that simply isn’t right. The structure is broken, and not enough players are getting the right level of coaching, advice and a direction to allow them develop.
There’s also part of me that refuses to accept that we have a small player pool from which to work with. I’m, perhaps foolishly, clinging to the hope that despite this our development is at fault, not the player pool available.
Wales doesn’t have that small of a registrant pool, 12th largest pool and just 17k behind Ireland in 10th.
Happy relief
Obviously every pool has large elements of players who are just playing for a laugh, but I’d imagine that in wales the difference in experience between the good players and those in it for just the beer is far smaller than in most other top tier countries
Not sure about that. In Ireland 99.9% are playing for the beer and craic. The ‘salads don’t win scrums’ majority. Then an elite 0.1% who have huge investment from school and a strong pathway through the provinces
Who the hell are these players in white shirts? This is not English rugby
Three mins until the half and England are going to be kicking themselves for somehow being behind after that first half. They’ve ran Ireland ragged, but Ireland have weathered, and taken the points whenever they’ve been in the england half. Weird half of rugby.
Wow…incredibly mature performance from Ireland here. 9 points up after being on the back foot for 35-40 of the 45 mins so far.