Minamino was starting to get games last season. He only went on loan because they couldn’t move on Origi to free up the space in the squad for Kabak.
1 Like
Don’t worry, we can keep this up until it opens again in the winter…and next summer… 
Not fancied by fans, perhaps. As I’ve repeatedly said, if he doesn’t fancy any of those options and felt that we’re light going forward, why then is our valuation of Origi so high? Why then did we not let Southampton have an option to buy on Minamino? Why did we start Oxlade-Chamberlain in our first game of the season?
3 Likes
Yes, it wasnt intended to be an inclusive list. I cited a number that was greater than the players I specifically name checked, so I take your point.
1 Like
Wrong narrative. He went on loan because he wasn’t as physically up to it (which says a lot) as Origi. Pointless in the end considering Origi barely played after that either.
Why is Ox not fancied? He was due to start v’s Burnley but attended the birth of his child, Elliot took his chance and now Ox will have to wait.
Origi isn’t fancied 100%, we are actively trying to sell him, by all accounts he has declined moves away… Hard to pin that on FSG really.
Minamino is a strange one, very good pre-season needs game time now.
1 Like
Has he actually? Or is that just the usual gossip on Twitter?
Another thing I find it hard to believe, is that anyone outside the club has any real knowledge over our transfer dealings and internal valuations of our players. After the Fabinho transfer, I thought it would be apparent to most that there is no genuine “ITK” when it comes to us.
Why “now”? I’m guessing that we are going to ease him in, especially while he works on the physicality of the game in the Premier League. Considering that we are shortly due to have a massive fixture pile-up, we should see plenty of him over this time.
Now is a general word, not to be taken litterally… I.e. the next steps for Minamino is for him to play…
The problem for him is he wasn’t getting in ahead of Mane/Salah/Jota for the first few games.
Ease him in? He’s been here 18 months and has hardly kicked a ball for us.
He went to Soton and in the end couldn’t get in there either.
The Prem isn’t for him.
2 Likes
Well you also produced meaningless stats to convince us that Origi is the answer. So I’d say both are somewhat extreme
2 Likes
Ox gets more chances than the others but he’s hardly set the world alight since his return from injury.
We needed something different when Chelsea went down to 10 men but both ox and minamino were overlooked.
1 Like
The answer to what?
To get this out of the way, you quite clearly have the opinion that Origi is not a good player. So I’m not surprised by your nitpicking on the one thing I have said, avoiding the rest of the discussion.
My original reply with regards to the statistics was to @Sweeting talking about how Origi offers nothing. Considering that he has in other posts (unless I’m confusing him with someone else) said that nothing can really be inferred from the past shitshow of a season, I thought it might be worth reminding people that when Origi was our fourth-choice forward, he offered quite a few goals and assists, despite the current prevailing narrative about him being good for nothing. Considering he’s nothing but effectively just sixth-choice at the moment, I’d say there are few other players out there we could bring in to be sixth-choice and therefore play that much, with that proven ability.
What’s the point of spending just to improve sixth-choice? We would want someone who is top-drawer, who wouldn’t cost us too much relatively speaking, or someone who is younger and therefore would not be too upset with more limited game-time, but has much potential to develop.
You call me extreme, but the question is, who’s being more realistic about our current situation, not just financially, but also squad-wise, and organisationally?
That’s an exaggeration, he started 9/18 games including 4 of the last 6 games.
3 Likes
It’s Chelsea though, there is a huge difference with giving Taki/Ox a chance v’s anyone other than the top 6 but Klopp won’t do it v’s the top 6 (until they are trusted to do so).
Klopp rang the right changes (too late if I’m honest), it was also game 3 and we still have players yet to reach match fitness (Thiago for example).
Quite clearly the manager did not think we “needed something different”. I’m not entirely sure we were starved of opportunities, we just didn’t manage to pull off that final bit (with quite a bit of assistance from dear Anthony Taylor).
There seems to be a lot of romanticising over magical players who can come off the bench and do something entirely different. The truth is, while it’s easy to marvel at particular moments, looking at an entire game is different. As an example, let’s look at Daniel Sturridge. He’s obviously a player who can conjure things out of nowhere, but bringing him on means you would lose the whole rhythm of how we play, since he’s not as good in the press.
There’s also the problem of opinions having already been formed. What would have happened if for example, we brought Minamino on, and then we failed to score? The narrative would then switch to Minamino’s not good enough, despite the fact that right now, our best forwards also failed to score. What if we brought Oxlade-Chamberlain on, and then with the resulting destabilisation of the midfield from introducing someone new, we conceded a goal? Would he then also be too shite?
1 Like
You can’t compare stats from a few sub appearances to those that played every game. Totally invalid. Also, should he not have helped out during out ‘shitshow’ season?
He’s started 33 games in 8 years. He’ll always be a legend due his CL exploits but I’m amazed we haven’t replaced him yet
1 Like
I was extremely underwhelmed (and disappointed) with him last season. With his size and strength he should have been able to contribute to the team - especially given how much we were hurting with injuries - but he disappeared. When he did see the pitch, I saw someone going through the motions rather than actually playing to maintain a place in the side. Maybe perception is incorrect but I found him to lack any real desire to be in the team and, apart from one goal against Newcastle at the end of the 19/20 season, he hasn’t scored a meaningful goal since December 2019.
I love the guy for his past exploits but his struggles extend to before the Covid lockdown and I don’t see us selling someone who got less than 200 minutes in the league last season as any kind of negative effect on the squad.
5 Likes
I note that you’re fixated on the Origi point and completely ignored the original point, which was the suggestion that I was too extreme. I’ve already repeatedly addressed those points in the Origi thread, which this is not, so you can peruse that instead if that’s what you want to focus on.
The lock picker…a single player who can create magic by beating a packed defense with one pass. It’s a bit of a naive expectation because in the absence of a Messi that really isn’t how those defenses are broken down.
3 Likes