I’m surprised thought he didn’t complete any, he was particularly poor today.
I think loss of desire is the wrong metric, as desire is impossible to measure. Desire is an internal thing.
But we are seeing a tired team, mentally and physically, and of course one that is significantly hindered by injuries.
We are currently five points off top four.
It would be nice to be within three points of top four by the World Cup break, and also to have the CL knockout stages in the bag.
Then regroup, and find a way to make something good out of this dog turd of a season.
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I read that this year there was an agreement that teams playing on Wednesday night in the Champions a league would not be selected for 12.30 sat kick offs.
When Liverpool queried this match they were told it doesn’t count because the match on Wednesday wasn’t a Champions League game.
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Well match fixture on bbc website definitely says Champions League…was it befor or aft…or didn’t they specify…
100%. This squad and their coaching team has done more than enough to demonstrate their mentality and character over the past 5 years. Possibly more than any team ever. It’s such lazy reasoning to accuse them of lacking desire. There is so much complex psychology involved in over performing for years, coming close to perfection last year, constant injuries, refereeing decisions, some players past their physical peak etc etc.
I think we all agree that the squad needs freshened up, but these haven’t become arrogant, lazy or poor players overnight
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Agree movement is paramount but also quick passing, pass inside to create space outside out, go short to feet to create space long, but then the pass needs to be played to exploit the space which isn’t happening.
All we are doing is pass it around the periphery and really on a cross into a packed box.
Our best moves came from quick interplay, movement and a good pass which mostly involved Harvey
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That went well.
FML
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yep,
agree here with this.
its a long way from a good performance, but up until the final third of the park i thought the lads were OK. not great, but OK, good in posession, as the stats suggest. its easy to play that down because forest weren’t interested in the ball nso it does follow a natural path of being able to keep it, but we still probed nicely and came back out with accuracy
just a point on the set up, we had two kids starting the game and maybe they aren’t ready to shoulder the burden in the same team together…great in passive possesion, but when something needed to be done in the final third, it was just rinse and repeat. Elliot tried to force the issue a few times, but it was more effort than anything else.
in moments like todays game, when you used to have a Diaz, Mane and Salah on the park together, one of them always had the authority and experience to drop out, create the havoc, move out of space…virtually assist the goal by removing themselves or doing something against the blueprint.
its not on the two lads, as you then have Virgil who could have had a hattrick trying to play five a side street football by assisting from five yards out, Mo who genuinely looks like hes just running at players without the belief he’ll actually get past them …like hes running at them because thats ‘what used to work’, he no longer has the ability to drift out of the game because the whole show has been placed on his shoulders in games like today… he was great against City, but he needs the ability to allow himself to drift out of a game and come back into it…hes basically just standing at the front door and knocking on it, where as he used to be able to duck around the side gate and see if the back door was open.
the whole things really dissappointing in the final third, and most of thats on Klopp, the fitness of the squad and in my mind, FSG.
im watching more football now with my kids as they enter that age where they get whats going on, and its really hard to explain to them that fundamentally, what we were doing in the first two thirds was technically correct, apart from maybe moving with greater urgency when we finally had a few forest players committing forward.
i dont think Joe was as bad as people want to make out, but yes, he wasnt great in moments.
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So is the interaction between performance and fatigue. There is a normal cycle where you have time off after a season to recharge, regain sharpness in pre-season then go through the cycle of playing, accumulating fatigue, recovering and playing again. We are not in a normal cycle. What we did last year was too much (notably, in part with very little rotation from Klopp down the stretch), followed by a shorter than normal summer break, culminating in a pre-season geared for marketing rather than player development.
What we know of top athletes is they can generate so much stress, either from unusually intense isolated efforts of multiple/sustained efforts over a long period, that they push fatigue to territory where it no longer dissipates in the normal cycle. Once you get there you have to step back and give it some time. A tennis player might pull out of early season tournaments under these conditions, but we cannot as we are constrained by the external forces of the world’s footballing calendar. What we then find ourselves with is going into the busiest season in history already with a chronically high level of fatigue that is preventing us hitting normal levels of performance, and in an ongoing calendar of commitments that doesn’t allow us to take the breath we need to get back to a normal baseline.
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Some absolute fucking nonsense being spouted in this thread. Toys being hurled all over the place. Usual suspects, usual insults.
Was today’s result really that much of a surprise? Obviously was to some people. After all, we should be beating these with the fucking tea-lady, groundsman and turnstile operator in the starting 11. Should still have enough quality! Should still have too much for them! Fuck me, how delusional can you get?
Kelleher
Trent Alexander-Arnold
Matip
Konate
Tsimikas
Henderson
Keita
Thiago
Diaz
Nunez
Jota
That’s some fucking team isn’t it? Probably good enough to beat any club-side in Europe on it’s day. Not one of them started today. O.k, Kelleher and Tsimikas are red herrings, they were available but 2nd choice, the other 9 either missing or having their minutes managed (Trent and Henderson) because they’re fucking knackered.
It’s laughable to think that starting 11 had some sort of divine right to win because we’re Liverpool FC which seems to be the opinion of a large section of the fanbase.
Just look at it. How many would expect to start if everyone was fit and in form? I’d say 5. Alisson, Robbo, VVD, either Fabinho or Elliott and Salah.
We had a 36 year old midfielder at RB. Gomez is 4th choice and has a mistake in him every fucking game. Fabinho is suffering the biggest drop-off in form I think I’ve ever seen from a professional footballer. Jones isn’t match-fit and quite frankly hasn’t pushed on from his derby-winner 4 fucking years ago. Bobby is goosed and has started 3 games in 6 days. Carvalho is nowhere near ready to be a starter for this club.
That team we fielded today was fucking dogshit. By all means debate the reasons why we were reduced to playing a team that looked more like the line-up for a Carabao Cup tie at Stoke but get some perspective FFS.
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Missing Darwin and Thiago. They’d have made a huge difference
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My mate said you can reduce our chances by 50% without Thiago and he is right.
Darwin right now without Luiz or Jota is also vital, hopefully whatever it is doesn’t keep him out much longer and he can play some part in the final 6 games before the break.
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Something is not right,don’t know what and conjecture is futile
The lads have played a hell of a lot of football,is it just burnout,seems like a chance!
Dunno,too far away to know and haven’t seem this game yet.
Not interested in criticising anyone,though.
If the lads are burning out the crush of fixtures in the name of money could well have a role.
If I’m honest I do think pre season was a fuck up and we went into that first game with 8 players out it I remember, whatever happened we are still effected by our approach in June and July.
Let’s see whether this is simply a bump on the road or something more serious. I am starting to tire of 12.30pm kick offs after we’ve played on a Wednesday.
Especially as we never seem to be at home for them, BT seem to have an issue with us, probably after Klopp had that issue with that wanker Des Kelly.
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I didn’t watch the game. I have been reading that we were lethargic. I thought with young and fresh players like Elliott, Carvalho, Curtis; we will have an energetic display. What happened?
That’s 3 out of 10 outfield players. And Carvalho played in a tough position and frankly he’s not ready yet for the physicality that’s needed
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How about watching some games from time to time and you can make up your own mind?
We showed up, got beat and left.
I thought the team dominated the game but just didn’t have any energy to finish it off. Clearly showing fatigue, obviously, through injuries and game congestion. I fear it will only get worse, after the WC.
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As soon as I saw the team I was concerned. Still thought we would have enough.
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It’s the Premier League & we’re completely off the pace…not just a bad day at the office, we are completely off it, we can lose to anyone and that was the case before today. Hopefully one thing that’s learnt from today is that the XI that started this afternoon should never ever start another game again.
He was alright again today but how many more times are we going to see Milner at RB?
How many more times does Gomez want to screw us over?
Robbo’s played this season as though his mind is elsewhere? Don’t know whats got into him. Was Sadio really the heart, backbone, brains, lungs, liver, kidney, legs of this team?
Still yet to be convinced Elliott is ready at this level, very raw…same could be said for Fabio.
Jones is just uninspiring, never really does anything of note.
Bobby gets a pass due to the season he’s had but very unlikely he can keep that up this season considering his age and fitness levels.
& then you got Mo who doesn’t look like he can give a fuck carrying this team anymore & tbh I don’t really blame him.
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