The Unreliable Rumours Discussion Thread (Part 2)

[redfanman]

@The-AllMightyReds

& that’s fantastic from a business point of view, but what good will this do for us fans on the pitch? The fans that pay good hard earned money to see their team do well and be successful?

So every new player we bring in regardless of price, we have to hope that they exceed all expectations and can be the next Mane Salah Fab Gini Robbo Matip etc?

I find this a really odd comment to make. If the club doesn’t have the money to go toe to toe on specific transfers with City, Utd and others then it has to cut its cloth accordingly.

We have seen first hand what happens when it doesn’t do that in the past - the debts we loaded up on under H&G is the most obvious example but the decline from the late 80’s shouldn’t be forgotten either.

And whose expectations are we talking about here - the club’s or the fans - many on here were not wanting us to sign the players you list but for example, Mane’s numbers were really good. Our ‘hit rate’ under FSG has largely been excellent.

[Mascot]

@The-AllMightyReds

When you really dive down into it & it doesn’t take much, anyone can do it if they bothered giving it a bit of time, into our recent success…very little comes from anything FSG have done.

If they get blame for everything that goes wrong, they should also get credit when things go right.

[mackie]

@The-AllMightyReds

I’m not having a meltdown and certainly not crying about anything…

You have no self-awareness, you are doing exactly those things, writing off a season before the pre-season has even started.

Chill out.

[RedOpium]

Lynch says definitely signing a CB and we will be signing a midfielder i think for a combined fee of around 65m ish.

[rab]

@The-AllMightyReds

When you really dive down into it & it doesn’t take much, anyone can do it if they bothered giving it a bit of time, into our recent success…very little comes from anything FSG have done.

How much of United’s success came from the John Magnier and J.P McManus versus what came from Ferguson.

How much of City’s success is down to Pep rather than the Sheik given they’ve only really begun to dominate since his arrival.

Were Chelsea great because of the money or because of Mourinho?

How much of Wenger’s success was because of whoever owned them at the time?

Of course success is driven by the manager and the players. But that’s the manager they lured to the club and they put the infrastructure in place that has allowed him to succeed. They don’t deserve to have their names sung from the roof tops for that, that’s what we hope and expect from them. but to say the clubs success has little to do with them is disingenuous. Ultimately every success stems from them and the decisions they’ve made.

[Istanbill]

You’re right mate, you’re not having a meltdown I’m just being hyperbolic. Apologies.

And given some previous windows it’s understandable people would have doubts about the club delivering in the transfer market.

But this time last year we were an elite club coming off the back of reaching every final and securing over 90 points. It would be like the 8th or 9th highest points total in premier league history I think.

One bad season, admittedly a really bad one, shouldn’t be enough to lose as much faith as many, including yourself, are doing.

This summer should be different. Klopp acknowledging business needs to be done, instead of fronting anyone who suggested we were light in midfield like he did last summer. The lads whose contracts have run out, without being cruel, have been a weight around our neck but their leaving frees up money and squad spaces. A proper pre-season with a squad that hasn’t been thoroughly exhausted by the most draining campaign imaginable the prior year. A run of form in the last 14 or so games that shows signs of recovery and that our level is still much higher than Newcastle and United.

It’s just way too soon to be so pessimistic.

[RedWhippet]

@rab

How much of United’s success came from the John Magnier and J.P McManus versus what came from Ferguson.

The Ferguson analogy is pretty fair. I think it is noticeable that they allowed their squad to age considerably in his last couple of years. When he left their form fell off a cliff and Moyes took much of the blame, but he wasn’t the one relying on players in their late 30s.

We obviously had Milner but he hasn’t been the most obvious problem. We have been relying on players 10 years younger than him that have failed to maintain fitness.

[The-AllMightyReds]

I’ve given the credit for numerous things they’ve got right, although it seems like a very long time ago now.

2016 - First plans to redeveloping Anfield (although I can’t help but think this is done with the intention of maximising their own capital - but it does work out nicely for us fans so that I appreciate and thank them for).

2015 - Putting a package deal together to entice Klopp was exceptional.

Then before that you have to go back right to the start when they cleared our 200m debt over time & shortly after getting rid of that atrocity of a manager (which lets face it, any new owner would’ve done).

[Sweeting]

@The-AllMightyReds

P.S - I have a bad feeling Taylor Swift might be the best thing I see at Anfield next season, happy to be proven wrong.

Given how excited you were then I expect this would be true no matter what else happens.

[WeeJoe]

@The-AllMightyReds

P.S - I have a bad feeling Taylor Swift might be the best thing I see at Anfield next season, happy to be proven wrong.

Your contributions in a nutshell

[FGred]

After watching the U21 matches yesterday it is only Thuram and Kone for me forget gravenberch and Veiga those two will only cost us the same as a Chiesa or Barella no brainer

[Limiescouse]

@Mascot

That’s all good and well, but all the serious links are to players at the Euro U21s. The final isn’t until 8th July, and I think the French lads would expect to be playing in that.

That isn’t a real impediment. Deals routinely get finalized while a player is at a tournament, and ones more important than youth tournaments. If anything, the known location and large amount of downtime makes it a good place to get the last part of deals done.

Whatever is happening that is preventing our alleged interest get to completion of a deal, it is incredibly unlikely to be us holding back until the tournament is over.

[RedOverTheWater]

Let’s imagine there are four midfield players at the U21 and we like all of them, but only want two of them. Maybe we have already had discussions with all four, agreed fee and wages, or thereabouts, and all that remains is to sign it off.

There are various permutations of who we might sign from the four, but we are taking a last look at how they perform, and perhaps crucially, making sure they come through the tourney without a bad injury.

We aren’t locked in to a particular player right now, in a ‘must have’ sort of a way. We already decided MacAllister was the one, and got that sorted early doors. So now we are letting the next couple of weeks play out before closing the remaining deals.

The same sort of thing might equally apply to two defenders. We like both, and we will sign one, but we are waiting to see how it all shakes down.

[redfanman]

@RedOverTheWater

Let’s imagine there are four midfield players at the U21 and we like all of them, but only want two of them. Maybe we have already had discussions with all four, agreed fee and wages, or thereabouts, and all that remains is to sign it off.

There are various permutations of who we might sign from the four, but we are taking a last look at how they perform, and perhaps crucially, making sure they come through the tourney without a bad injury.

We aren’t locked in to a particular player right now, in a ‘must have’ sort of a way. We already decided MacAllister was the one, and got that sorted early doors. So now we are letting the next couple of weeks play out before closing the remaining deals.

The same sort of thing might equally apply to two defenders. We like both, and we will sign one, but we are waiting to see how it all shakes down.

Sounds unlikely to me. I would think if there is a delay it is because it still hasn’t been agreed either with player or club. Performance in this tournament is unlikely to make much difference as they have probably watched them regular for the last few seasons.

[Aldo_Saitta]

Look at Chelsea, they spent a lot of money and. finish 12th, with the same amount probably we will have 3 very good players

[RedOverTheWater]

A bad injury in this tournament might make a big difference.

Let’s say we like player A and B and plan to sign one of them. Player A gets a bad injury in the u21 tourney. So we sign player B.

[Limiescouse]

@RedOverTheWater

We aren’t locked in to a particular player right now, in a ‘must have’ sort of a way. We already decided MacAllister was the one, and got that sorted early doors. So now we are letting the next couple of weeks play out before closing the remaining deals.

The links to Valverde and Tchouameni have been weird and I laughed them off as typical summer nonsense. But I wonder if we have some inside knowledge of what is going on with Mbappe and that has caused us to slow roll those deals we’d assumed we’d be making?

If the Mbappe move does happen, all of sudden an exit for a player Real value, like those 2 mentioned, make a lot more sense given they’ve already spent a lot of the Mbappe kitty on Jude. I wonder if we made plans without consideration of these Real players we have already vetted and really like but ignored due to a presumed unavailability. But now we’ve heard word of Mbappe moving, we’re slow rolling our originally planned moves to see if either of those shakes loose and creates an opportunity we hadnt thought would be there.

[Istanbill]

I’m pretty sure I’m about to chat some absolute nonsense here that can rightfully be dismissed, but I did wonder if the whole ‘not wanting to make a bid or complete a transfer while the U21 Euros is on’ is just a line to give the club a little bit more time to see what the markets about to do.

We might love Kone and Thuram, and the other two as well, but don’t wanna blow our load on two players who are a bit of a risk if there’s a chance one of Real Madrid lads becomes available later in the window or the price for Barella becomes affordable for example.

I’m the meantime we can tell players and agents ‘you just focus on the tournament now’.

[redfanman]

@RedOverTheWater

A bad injury in this tournament might make a big difference.

Let’s say we like player A and B and plan to sign one of them. Player A gets a bad injury in the u21 tourney. So we sign player B.

They could get injured the first day of training. A delay makes less sense if they are players we want to sign as it leaves open the chance that another party comes in with a higher bid or the selling club to change its mind and delays our preparation.

@limiescouse’s point about other players makes more sense - we are known to have wanted the two players he mentioned, if we genuinely believe they could be available for a fee we could afford then it may be reason enough to delay.

[RedOverTheWater]

Sounds plausible to me. If there is a possibility to sign Tchouameni, a player we know Klopp likes, then we will give it every chance to come about. If not, we move on to, say, Kone.

Mbappe’s possible move might have some bearing on the timing of deals.

Another thought is that minor investment might be a factor, too. John Henry said a couple months ago, in one of his rare interviews, that various things are being considered and we might know more in summer. Or words to that effect.

So maybe, to use the two player mentioned, if investment doesn’t kick in, we are going for Kone and hopefully another, around the 35M mark. But if investment does kick in, we upgrade to a Tchouameni?

While I’m writing, there is another big financial variable that I barely want to mention, but it might be something. The Saudis are buying. An official made a statement that any player on the market is of interest to them. The official went further and name checked Mo Salah, although he did concede that the timing might not work, as Mo has records to set at Liverpool.

Anyway, for all we know, the Saudis are throwing a lot of money at Mo behind the scenes, and they are prepared to offer a fee that nodoby thought was possible for Mo at this stage of his career, but they are changing the parameters. So maybe that is also a factor, as for all we know, there might be another £150M in play, and we need to sign a wide forward, in addition to strengthening the midfield and defence.

Lots of possible permutations.

I’m chilled, and will be surprised if we do not sign at least two, probably three, more players.