Memories of living in Oz. We had an almond orchard out back. Horrible job picking the almonds while dodging the Red-back and Trap door spiders before long evenings removing both the shuck and the shell from them all.
But that still doesn’t compare to the paper round I had out there. Yes that’s right I was the one that had THAT paper round. When my Dad saw it he went nuts and even I told them to shove their job after that one evening. I can laugh now but it was pure horror on that day, proper taking the pee stuff that not even @Klopptimist would have done.
with the labour shortages you are currently experiencing…is it not an opurtunity to negotiate different pay rates?
historically, the period after the black plague is credited with creating wage pressure and ultimately the renaissance, isnt it?
in an uneducated observation, if you have swathes of labour avaliable (and you both agree you have) and loads of tasks to do, but those tasks are not particularily well paid or desirable, then dont you negotiate a larger chunk to do them?
with the exodus of cheap, willing labour comes the oppurtunity for employer groups to negotiate better condition
you might not like the idea of driving a truck, or picking cherries, but if your renumeration and work conditions improved the task becomes more desirable.
i mean, being a proctologist is surely only desirable becuase it is so well paid, theres no other reason to want to investigate strangers arses is there? and you could say that about most jobs, very few are actually fullfilling…i mean, most middle management jobs are purely just data collection and administration performed in clothes that make you feel important…compared to being in the open and picking food for the masses it really isnt more desirable… same thing with delivering goods…in a truck, open road, horizon in front of you, choice of music…no cheryl from accounts complaining about marcus from HR at the water cooler…
klopptomist is right in a way…it is indicative about whats broken in society when you have a whole heap of people doing nothing when theres alot to be done…but its a slightly shifted point i make…but you know…that would require a strong employer representative pressence and change from the usal big business driven agenda of ‘they want how much to pick cherries? we’ll all be doomed’ when all its really doing is re distributing a bit of the profit back to the worker.
True, but has a massive ramification on cost of living, as farmers need to increase the price they sell at, so suppliers pass that onto the supermarkets which pass it on the customer, but unless the entire low-medium wage earners also see an increase then standards of living will increase for a small number of people, but drop for a larger proportion. That pay increase then sees other prices rise for goods like gas, electricity, rent ect so the base standard of living increases, but goes the number living above it? Not guaranteed, so you walk a very tight line increasing the pay rates for these jobs as it can have a major effect on the econoy and standard of living a large parts of the country
Yes you’re right but remember this government has just given people and business a tax hike. Basically, they’ve just pushed people down further.
The problem is a massive one which prompted the discussions earlier on the minimum wage. Again that is not moving under this government, so the leveling up is just BS, but simply hiking that minimum wage upward doesn’t solve the problems either because you drag other people into that minimum wage bracket, and of course it all has to be paid for somehow.
Also the result of increasing wages (and / or employing more emergency driver cover from the EU) is prices will go up. This is already likely to happen due to the rising costs of imports. Increased wages will also impact prices on UK goods. There’s a strong argument that needs to happen but it cant happen at the expense of putting more people into poverty. Energy prices are also increasing.
And quite honestly if this government which contains the likes of Raab, Patel, Truss, and Kwarteng who co-authored a book on UK workers being the laziest in the world, raises working standards I’d buy a jar of Vegemite. These people have just told lorry drivers to work longer hours. Saying Brexit will improve UK working conditions under a Tory government is just pie in the sky.
That said maybe we’re lazy because we’re paid peanuts.
i dont truely believe by increasing the labour to pick a peice of fruit that the end product becomes significantly higher…there are so many other componants involved in getting that cherry from a seedling to the supermarket shelf that we need to be realistic about what the actual impact of actually just picking the thing would cost.
and its not just wages…what about the hours expected …what about if you could do a four hour run…yknow…after dropping the kids off to school…thats a condition worth investigating.
there are so many parents who want to be involved in thier kids lives but still earn a little on the side
i mean, you could even just reduce the amount of tax paid by the individual in certain industries.
agreed its a tight line, not every business is absolutely creaming it with a big fat pinstriped shirt wearing cigar smoking arsehole running the show, but…but…theres room in the economy to increase wages, even if they are subsidised for a short period.
we also need to strongly look at the pressure of listed companies to forever INCREASE shareholders market returns driving prices up and labour down.
The challenging position is determining the new normal.
Jeremy Clarksons farm was enlightening. His entire year profit before EU subsidies was just £144. Its tempting to say just raise prices, however farms are coming under increasing pressures from the new FTAs. This is why its such an issue with Australia (and anticipated shortly New Zealand) being able to compete to sell its produce. Farmers will get squeezed.
Whilst EU approach was protectionist. It did serve an important service. It protected rural communities and it helped protect the environment.
The UK needs to determine the new normal. Both what can be sold home and abroad (given brexit effect on economics), labour issues, and general protection of the countryside.
At this point in time its less than clear, and I think many farms will go out of business.
Which is the logical situation in a free market. If your business doesn’t make money it goes bust. There is a good argument that the government must ensure sufficient food / energy production though. Interesting times ahead which will be resolved by £££££.
Food security (See how China and Russia both use trade as a tool to apply pressure, to shortages due to pandemic)
Environment (British Countryside is beautiful, varied and full of life. Cant beat it on a summers day. Farming plays an important part of protecting the ecosystem. From maintaining walkways to reducing environmental impact (Its much better to farm local than ship it across the entire world
Standards - You have much greater control over what you eat. From poor practice and chlorinated chickens to use of hormones.
Local communities. If farms go out of business the knock-on effect will be on those small villages and towns. These are some of the nicest parts of the UK. A farms going out of business has knock-on effect to many industries.
Farmers have had it really good for 40 years or more - I can recall when the EU was paying farmers not to grow produce because of oversupply (termed set aside). They have received subsidies for decades - there are not many businesses that can say that.
Just like those investors that moan when the stock market goes down, completely forgetting about the gains they have made when the going is good. Farmers are just the same.
Their assets are tightly held, passed from generation to generation, with the land slowly but surely becoming more and more valuable. Land appreciates because it is limited in supply; consequently, as the population increases, so does the demand for land, driving its price up over time.
Those farmers that work their own land - get their hands dirty on a daily basis - I feel slightly for them. Those that sit in the big house overseeing the serfs - I wouldn’t give them the (cow) shit off my welly boots.
Unless you’re a bank, of course. In which case, have a barrel load of taxpayers cash and carry on doing exactly what you were doing that caused you to get into difficulty.
If we think some businesses are too important to be allowed to fail, surely farms are at the very top of that list?
Not to @Redbj’s point. He suggested people come to together to demand better working conditions for doing the sort of jobs we are short of. My points was that kind of collective bargaining is really hard as the majority of the country have been conditioned to believe unions are evil. There is also the problem that most of these jobs are not unionised and collectivity is strongly discouraged.
It’s those that are likely to come out of any quick changes that are introduced without a safety net better than those small working farms.
yesterday I heard one person describe the current pig cull as similar to Foot and Mouth. Farmers literally having to walk round their fields shooting pigs where they stand before collecting them with a digger and burying them in a big hole.
